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Say Bye - To a Killie Pie?


baz

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The name or word "Killie" doesn't belong to the football club .... however they do appear to have secured its use in conjunction with certain items and in that respect JG might have a bit of a fight on his hands.... and I actually hope the club win it.  If this same scenario arose and we hadn't trademarked it then there would still be a load of moaning going on.

 

My issue is that another long term sponsor is being shuffled out of the way by the dictator.  If the contract is going out to tender then imo it has to be done openly so there can be no controversy. 

Have all the bids sealed and presented to the club at a public meeting. .. say the AGM or a KSA meeting, and the winner is announced immediately. 

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2 hours ago, chubbs said:

The name or word "Killie" doesn't belong to the football club .... however they do appear to have secured its use in conjunction with certain items and in that respect JG might have a bit of a fight on his hands.... and I actually hope the club win it.  If this same scenario arose and we hadn't trademarked it then there would still be a load of moaning going on.

 

My issue is that another long term sponsor is being shuffled out of the way by the dictator.  If the contract is going out to tender then imo it has to be done openly so there can be no controversy. 

Have all the bids sealed and presented to the club at a public meeting. .. say the AGM or a KSA meeting, and the winner is announced immediately. 

If we wait for the AGM we might just starve.......

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10 hours ago, chubbs said:

Have all the bids sealed and presented to the club at a public meeting. .. say the AGM or a KSA meeting, and the winner is announced immediately. 

AND THE WINNER IS!

scotch-pie-51-p.jpg

he would say it with a straight f**king face as well.

 

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12 hours ago, Tonzer said:

I'll ask one last rhetorical question - Do you think that Brownings attempting to take the trademark from the club is the right thing to do and in the clubs best interests? (That might be two)
It's pretty much the only thing we disagree on here.

Well a rhetorical question doesn't really require an answer but I'll give you one anyway...I don't think that Brownings are attempting to take the trademark from the club, it appears to be the other way around, the club are opposing Brownings trademark. The club have not trademarked the Killie Pie, they have trademarked the name Killie. Brownings are not seeking to use the name for anything other than the product that they have invested heavily in to produce, market and sell. Yes they use 'our' name (which is not exclusive to the football club), yes we should probably get a wee slice of the pie (sic) on overall sales...but it may prove difficult to determine total sales given their wide product base. I'm pretty sure that we could have done a deal with John had the decision not already been made.

I don't think that Brownings selling a Killie Pie will affect the club negatively in the slightest...unless they suddenly become s**t. I don't think if we had someone decent in charge that Brownings would even have to try and secure the name of the pie through trademark...this is only happening because he went public with what he thought about MJ's regime and that man is looking for pay back. If anyone honestly thinks this is anything to do with making the club money then they are kidding themselves on. If the club parted company with Brownings for legitimate reasons (and that could happen of course) and MJ wasn't involved then they could continue making Killie Pies, and any pies sold in the tea bars at Rugby Park could also be named the same.

Looking at this from a purely economical point of view...if they sell pies in the tea bars at Rugby Park, fans will buy them no matter who makes them, because it is a closed market, there is nothing else available to the consumer. Kilmarnock Football Club have NO outside outlets to sell pies and only sell them at the stadium on match days....at most 25-30 days a year. In real terms how does Brownings selling Killie Pies affect that in any way whatsoever? Does this answer your question(s) or does this raise more?

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Piegate! However I am more concerned about what is happening on the pitch than a business argument between two companies, from which we have heard through the grapevine one side of a story and nothing from the other side, which in mind is the correct way to do business. The Board of Kilmarnock FC need to do what is right for KFC, and if someone doesn't like that then tough.

I don't know all the ins and outs of this story, only one side seems to have "leaked" some info regarding it. If I wanted to look good then I would just leak the stuff which shows me in a good light and keep the real deal under wraps. Just my thoughts and no doubt I will get hammered for saying so!

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53 minutes ago, CBFC said:

However I am more concerned about what is happening on the pitch than a business argument between two companies, ...

I think there is a connection between all the off the field stuff over the years and what is happening on the pitch.

A few good results won't simply make everything in the garden rosy again.

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38 minutes ago, CBFC said:

However I am more concerned about what is happening on the pitch

Insinuating that anyone who comments negatively on this thread or otherwise is not. I'm pretty concerned with what is happening on the pitch as well; so is every Killie fan I know. Deflecting attention away from the issue by highlighting how bad things have been on the park is probably not a good strategy. Why are we so bad on the park and how has it got to this? Try looking at the big picture which you think we should be ignoring. We're not stupid you know, we can think about more than one thing at a time without our heads exploding.

 

43 minutes ago, CBFC said:

a business argument between two companies, from which we have heard through the grapevine one side of a story and nothing from the other side, which in mind is the correct way to do business.

As far as I know you will hear about it more than just through the grapevine. Why do you think you have heard nothing from the other side? Something to do with the fact they know the news will not go down well? Maybe the fact that they know MJ has a serious problem with JG and that all this has more to do with that than any financial common sense? How about taking a local business to court over a name which will mean absolutely nothing to us as we do not have any use for it...unless we are opening a bakers and are going to start distributing our pies nationally ourselves? Looking for a diversionary topic to draw attention away from the already late AGM as per the norm? No one would mind then doing business in the "correct way" (all information kept secret from those muppet football fans) if there was even an ounce of trust in that what they were doing was purely for the betterment of the club, but its not, no matter what bulls**t story they come out with. Next you'll be telling me that there was nothing dodgy about the sale of the bungalow which was done in the "correct way" and that the tender for selling off the car park for flats was also done in the "correct way" and that Manor Kingdom won that fairly and squarely. Insert rolling eyes smiley here.

 

53 minutes ago, CBFC said:

The Board of Kilmarnock FC need to do what is right for KFC, and if someone doesn't like that then tough.

What if its the board themselves who don't get it? Is that tough as well? Certainly seems to be. I have taken a look at this from a purely economical point of view in my previous post. I would like you to read that and tell me how Killie, the football club, are going to make a lot of money, or any money for that matter, out of stopping Brownings using the name Killie Pie.

 

56 minutes ago, CBFC said:

I don't know all the ins and outs of this story, only one side seems to have "leaked" some info regarding it. If I wanted to look good then I would just leak the stuff which shows me in a good light and keep the real deal under wraps. Just my thoughts and no doubt I will get hammered for saying so!

Okay, so you freely admit not to knowing anything about the story, then go on at length to tell us what is wrong about it. Is that not exactly what you are accusing anyone who 'leaks' anything of doing? Then you tell us the underhanded way you would go about proceedings by omitting details and keeping the real details quiet...you are not painting yourself in a very good light here D! I'm not hammering you here, I am addressing the points you have made in your post which is at best, ill informed by your own admission...and at worst hypocritical for the reasons already mentioned. I said it before and I will say it again, this is not about the Pies in reality, its about MJ getting his own back and Kilmarnock FC losing yet another sponsor/customer/loyal fan as a result.

I'm exceptionally saddened that the other directors are allowing this to happen. If this goes to court and we lose, which we well could do as clearly whoever allowed the 'Killie' trademark in the first place was not aware the town being called Killie was already well-established working practice...it could open the doors for anyone to start using Killie for other things which are purely football club associated. That's a gamble we are taking...for what gain exactly?

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26 minutes ago, baz said:

Insinuating that anyone who comments negatively on this thread or otherwise is not. I'm pretty concerned with what is happening on the pitch as well; so is every Killie fan I know. Deflecting attention away from the issue by highlighting how bad things have been on the park is probably not a good strategy. Why are we so bad on the park and how has it got to this? Try looking at the big picture which you think we should be ignoring. We're not stupid you know, we can think about more than one thing at a time without our heads exploding.

 

As far as I know you will hear about it more than just through the grapevine. Why do you think you have heard nothing from the other side? Something to do with the fact they know the news will not go down well? Maybe the fact that they know MJ has a serious problem with JG and that all this has more to do with that than any financial common sense? How about taking a local business to court over a name which will mean absolutely nothing to us as we do not have any use for it...unless we are opening a bakers and are going to start distributing our pies nationally ourselves? Looking for a diversionary topic to draw attention away from the already late AGM as per the norm? No one would mind then doing business in the "correct way" (all information kept secret from those muppet football fans) if there was even an ounce of trust in that what they were doing was purely for the betterment of the club, but its not, no matter what bulls**t story they come out with. Next you'll be telling me that there was nothing dodgy about the sale of the bungalow which was done in the "correct way" and that the tender for selling off the car park for flats was also done in the "correct way" and that Manor Kingdom won that fairly and squarely. Insert rolling eyes smiley here.

 

What if its the board themselves who don't get it? Is that tough as well? Certainly seems to be. I have taken a look at this from a purely economical point of view in my previous post. I would like you to read that and tell me how Killie, the football club, are going to make a lot of money, or any money for that matter, out of stopping Brownings using the name Killie Pie.

 

Okay, so you freely admit not to knowing anything about the story, then go on at length to tell us what is wrong about it. Is that not exactly what you are accusing anyone who 'leaks' anything of doing? Then you tell us the underhanded way you would go about proceedings by omitting details and keeping the real details quiet...you are not painting yourself in a very good light here D! I'm not hammering you here, I am addressing the points you have made in your post which is at best, ill informed by your own admission...and at worst hypocritical for the reasons already mentioned. I said it before and I will say it again, this is not about the Pies in reality, its about MJ getting his own back and Kilmarnock FC losing yet another sponsor/customer/loyal fan as a result.

I'm exceptionally saddened that the other directors are allowing this to happen. If this goes to court and we lose, which we well could do as clearly whoever allowed the 'Killie' trademark in the first place was not aware the town being called Killie was already well-established working practice...it could open the doors for anyone to start using Killie for other things which are purely football club associated. That's a gamble we are taking...for what gain exactly?

Pot kettle black here 

 claim CBFC is hypocritical however do u know both sides of the story?

if not why r u so intent to always be seen to go against the club at any opportunity

why did u need to go public why not wait until both sides of the story was told

why did JG go to u to be his mouthpiece can't he come on here himself

for some one in ur position (forum admin - u have power) u seem to be hell bent on damaging the club at every opp

maybe just maybe the club are in the right but don't let that stop u

 

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The elephant in the room in every discussion regarding the club is Johnston.

Just because Brownings has helped the club in the past doesn't mean to say that we have to continue with the same caterer without at least looking at other alternatives. Until we get some fan representation on the board we are outside looking in and only able to make an informed, or uninformed guess at the reasons for any board decision.

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9 minutes ago, Killiesub said:

Pot kettle black here 

 claim CBFC is hypocritical however do u know both sides of the story?

if not why r u so intent to always be seen to go against the club at any opportunity

why did u need to go public why not wait until both sides of the story was told

why did JG go to u to be his mouthpiece can't he come on here himself

for some one in ur position (forum admin - u have power) u seem to be hell bent on damaging the club at every opp

maybe just maybe the club are in the right but don't let that stop u

 

So who are you again? Still hiding behind that keyboard? Yes I do know both sides of the story, I have talked to both sides. Where does that leave your paranoid garbage about me attacking the club at every opportunity? Those who actually know me know I have done more for the club than you'll ever know...but don't let that stop you rattling on about something and someone you know nothing about. If I liked having the "power" that much I would just delete any comments I didn't agree with and ban guys like you who are scared to reveal their identity. As for pots and kettles, unless you any salient points to add...away and boil yer heid.

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4 minutes ago, baz said:

So who are you again? Still hiding behind that keyboard? Yes I do know both sides of the story, I have talked to both sides. Where does that leave your paranoid garbage about me attacking the club at every opportunity? Those who actually know me know I have done more for the club than you'll ever know...but don't let that stop you rattling on about something and someone you know nothing about. If I liked having the "power" that much I would just delete any comments I didn't agree with and ban guys like you who are scared to reveal their identity. As for pots and kettles, unless you any salient points to add...away and boil yer heid.

Can u give us the club side as so far all u have went on about is from the JG side and criticising the club

 

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B, as with most disputes I don't think either party will come out smelling of roses. I agree with a post above which said that JG should come on and give his version of the story. However I suspect that could prejudice his case should he have one.

 

I just feel that at this very important part of the season we need to concentrate on the football and then when it is all done and dusted we can get into the nitty gritty of what is wrong at the club. believe me, I don't think everything is rosy, far from it and there needs to major surgery going forward to improve the club or at least get it back to being the family, fan friendly club it was before.

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6 minutes ago, CBFC said:

I just feel that at this very important part of the season we need to concentrate on the football...

I feel that at this very important part of the season the players need to concentrate on the football.  The fans, they can concentrate on whatever they like.  

Do you seriously believe that fans discussing pie gate on an internet forum will impact our performances in the run in?

Edited by undefined
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The club have not trademarked the Killie Pie, they have trademarked the name Killie. 

 

Sorry Baz but it would appear that the club have indeed trademarked the word "Killie" for use with various groups of items ... One of which is pies and pastries.  But it will be decided by someone with a better understanding of the law than any of us ....  or MJ !

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I think that John will come out with something very soon and you can judge what he says from that. I 100% believe that catering should go to tender and the club should choose which is best for the club, can we trust them to do that though? Certainly not on previous experience. Not one person has actually had an answer to any of the points I've made because you know it makes sense. I'm not attacking the club, I am fully behind the manager and players and will give the club all the support I can I the run in and beyond come what may...I am forever questioning the board though, because they are forever making bad decisions and not only holding us back but dragging us down...I make no apology for that and will continue to give credit when it is due and criticism when that's due as well.

Paul I have seen the documentation, what will come into question is whether that is legitimate or not given that it can certainly be argued that calling the town Killie was considered working practice long before the football club existed and any good lawyer (don't know many of them though) could successfully argue that case...see all the PFN stuff regards Forfar Bridies, Arbroath Smokies etc...these things are not always cut and dried. Everyone will have to abide with what the courts rule at the end of the day, meanwhile we become a laughing stock yet again for getting involved in such 'Pie Wars' and our reputation, what's left of it, gets another kicking to the delight of the gutter press.

Brownings could probably make a fortune selling an "AntiKillie Pie" at loads of other grounds rather than chasing this...but it's not just about money for him. Don't get any ideas from that John or I'll trademark and demand a huge percentage!

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as posted by Skydog 3 years ago:

The term 'Killie' is trademarked to the club in the following instances.

List of goods and services

Class 3: Soaps; perfumes; cosmetics; hair lotions; detifrices; shampoo.
Class 9: Video tapes; records.
Class 14: Jewellery; watches; rings; pendants; key rings; earrings; tie pins.
Class 16: Stationery; pens; pencils; calenders; posters, books; printed matter; magazines; photographs; greeting cards; periodical publications; paper articles; cardboard articles.
Class 18: Bags; sports bags; umbrellas; rucksacks; school bags; school satchels; leather articles; wallets.
Class 21: Chinaware; glassware; ornaments of china or glass.
Class 25: Articles of clothing; boots; shoes; slippers; headgear.
Class 30: Confectionery; pies; pastries; crisps; snack foods.
Class 35: Promotion of sporting activities.
Class 41: Sporting services; services relating to the presentation of sporting activities; professional consultation in the field of sporting activities; advisory and consultancy services relating thereto.
Class 43: Catering services; restaurant services; cafeteria services
Expires 11/12/2018

Class 32: Alcoholic beverages being promotional goods relating to The Kilmarnock Football Club.
Class 33: Wines, spirits and liqueurs being promotional goods relating to The Kilmarnock Football Club.
Expires 11/12/2018

Class 32: Beers; ales; lagers; stouts; mineral water; aerated waters; non-alcoholic drinks; fruit drinks; fruit juices; syrups; preparations for making beverages; powders and pastilles for effervescing beverages; essences for making beverages; isotonic beverages; energy drinks; all being promotional goods relating to The Kilmarnock Football Club.
Expires 20/09/2015

 

 

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1 hour ago, undefined said:

I feel that at this very important part of the season the players need to concentrate on the football.  The fans, they can concentrate on whatever they like.  

Do you seriously believe that fans discussing pie gate on an internet forum will impact our performances in the run in?

I disagree, but that is what forums are all about. Opinions.

I just think everybody should be pulling together at this crucial time in the season.

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1 minute ago, CBFC said:

I just think everybody should be pulling together at this crucial time in the season

would agree but where has been the connection from the Board to the fans in recent weeks as we approach this critical period ---- no message from the Chairman --as yet no sign of any ideas to boost home fans for the upcoming important games -----or drum up interest ----

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