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Shropshire_killie

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5 hours ago, gdevoy said:

You know I was halfway through explaining how the ambulance drop off could be sorted in no time flat when I began to realise that you are right. It is a just a symptom of basic underfunding. Anything done to address it would just move the problem elsewhere.

Despite the bile spouted by Farage about immigration, underfunding in the NHS, public services generally and in defence funding is all a consequence of "austerity". which is the methodology the people voted for in 2010 to deal with the f**k up in the banking system in 2007. We could have chosen to make the dickhead coke sniffers of the square mile clean up their own mess but for some reason I don't understand we voted to unload the s**t onto those least able to pay.

And by the way, if you think austerity is unpleasant for the folks at the bottom of the s**t pile just wait till we get into the low wage low tax, US style economy that Brexit will bring.    

 

I’m not even sure if it’s an issue of underfunding. Although I do wish they’d use  figures adjusted for inflation and spending per patient as truer representations of the claims of increased healthcare spending. My belief is that the biggest issue is the funds being syphoned off from patient care to private business, through schemes like PFI. Some of the deals for these buildings and maintenance costs are beyond belief. This profligacy is often exacerbated by incumbent parties trying to outspend their opponents in building new hospitals etc. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

"Arm school teachers to make pupils safe."

Well armed professionals do make government offices safer than they wold otherwise be in Afghanistan but it really is a suboptimal solution when you compare it to say government offices in Scandinavian countries.  

And...............

If it is your ambition in life to educate the young you want to then live with the daily possibility of having to shoot one of your own pupils dead?

Why should some children fail to make it into adulthood because of the financial interests of the firearms industry?

 

 

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Quite incredible that they have got to this place. Have to say though, I think this will lose him a lot of support in States like Florida.

All it will take is for the Democrats to have a credible plan to tackle the issue and they could sweep the house imo. The ads write themselves, Trump accepted around $30million in donations from the NRA, he is bought on this issue and any decision he makes will be in their interests and no one elses

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1 hour ago, bute-killiefan said:

I think this will lose him a lot of support in States like Florida.

Suggesting the solution to any problem in the states is more gun ownership has never harmed any president in recent history.

Regardless of the number of casualties, age of casualties or ethnicity of casualties, supporting the NRA is always the smart move. There seems to be no price too high for the average American in the street to maintain their gun ownership.

Of course whenever one of these people's wife / husband or weans gets shot by somebody with a long history of psychiatric problems there is always the shocked, " How could this have happened  here is such a well adjusted, crime free community".

Just as embedded cultural values will cause people to support the death penalty for consenting adults enjoying intimacy in the privacy of their own home in some countries, so people will die in a ditch in the US to defend the "right" of any person to own a gun.

 

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2 hours ago, gdevoy said:

Suggesting the solution to any problem in the states is more gun ownership has never harmed any president in recent history.

Regardless of the number of casualties, age of casualties or ethnicity of casualties, supporting the NRA is always the smart move. There seems to be no price too high for the average American in the street to maintain their gun ownership.

Of course whenever one of these people's wife / husband or weans gets shot by somebody with a long history of psychiatric problems there is always the shocked, " How could this have happened  here is such a well adjusted, crime free community".

Just as embedded cultural values will cause people to support the death penalty for consenting adults enjoying intimacy in the privacy of their own home in some countries, so people will die in a ditch in the US to defend the "right" of any person to own a gun.

 

Maybe I am being too hopeful but something feels different about this one. I think Millennials in the US are as politically engaged as they have ever been and many of these kids in Florida will be of voting age come 2020, this makes me think Trump/Republicans are in trouble.

 

As for NRA, they will always back the Republican candidate. I'll never understand Democrats trying to pander to them

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Dear Donald

I listened to your address to the rabidly right wing today - it sounded from their reaction that they make you seem a tad pink. 

I was on the X Trainer at my gym and I had to keep looking around me after I uttered another “c**t”, “f**k you” or flipped you the bird. 

I’ve decided that what you really must do is die. Sounds drastic, I know but desperate situations require desperate measures and all that. 

I’m not much bothered how but you seemed to take great relish in describing how that MR19 group enjoy cutting their victims up into small pieces so that would be appropriate. 

Just don’t hang about though. Sooner the better! 

Yours etc

 

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Arming teachers will make school pupils safer?

There was a fecking armed police man on the premises in Florida. He had a hand gun, heard the heavy calibre automatic weapon and thought,what I have got is not much better than a peashooter in comparison. And he waited outside untill it was all over.

So much for arming school staff.

I know, let's give all the teachers flame throwers..........

Edited by gdevoy
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An armed officer assigned to the Florida school where a gunman killed 17 people last week stood outside the building during the shooting and did not intervene, the local sheriff says...

Trump's response: “He didn’t turn out to be too good, I tell you that. He turned out to be not good. He was not a credit to law enforcement, that I can tell you … He was tested under fire and it wasn’t a good result.”

He continued: “I’d rather have somebody that loves their students and wants to protect their students than somebody standing outside that doesn’t know anybody and doesn’t know the students and, frankly, for whatever reason, decided not go in even though he heard lots of shots being fired inside …

“A teacher would have shot the hell out of [the gunman] before he knew what happened.”

O.o

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10 minutes ago, Scooter said:

Trump's response: “He didn’t turn out to be too good, I tell you that. He turned out to be not good. He was not a credit to law enforcement, that I can tell you … He was tested under fire and it wasn’t a good result.”

I bet Trump would have run in gun blazing in the same circumstances...

He appeared to be linking gun crime with immigrants but I don't recall too many mass gun killings being committed by foreigners. Who knows though - there has been so many of them.

"Only more guns will make schools safer"! The man is insane.

 

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"Only more guns will make schools safer"; this is indeed a chilling statement.

The problem is, where would you even start in the prohibition and recalling of 300 million guns? 

The Right would see this as government tyranny and then I think you'd really see what well armed militias were all about.

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7 hours ago, Scooter said:

The problem is, where would you even start in the prohibition and recalling of 300 million guns? 

I’ve given this some thought (which makes me more qualified than # 45). 

You don’t have to recall or prohibit the sale of weapons, just stop and control the sale of ammunition. 

There would still be a black market in smuggled and illegally manufactured ammo but the amount in circulation would be massively reduced. 

 

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I am left speechless by how focused the US gun debate is obsessed with "good guys" and "bad guys".

I cannot believe that us citizens are unable to grasp that this is a cinematic concept introduced by Hollywood such that films have the same appeal as watching the local football team. "Our guys" vs "their guys". In Hollywood "all the guys" get up and go to the bar after the "shooting".

What we are discussing here is life changing injuries and deaths. It doesn't matter one bit whether the injuries and deaths happen to "good guys" or "bad guys", the object of the exercise is to prevent injuries and deaths. Just because you have been arbitrarily categorised as a "bad guy" by some random selection of individuals this does not justify your death. "Good guys" vs "bad guys"  is a childish play concept, injury and death is real.

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On 03/03/2018 at 12:17 PM, Shropshire_killie said:

Trump said he would have run into the school "unarmed". Oh Really?, None of us can predict our reaction to such events but  its a fact Trump nicely evaded his Vietnam call up with a "sore foot",  despite being witnessed playing Golf, Hockey and Football. Big brave Donald my arse.Draft Dodging Coward!

He is an actual child

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On ‎27‎/‎02‎/‎2018 at 9:35 AM, gdevoy said:

I am left speechless by how focused the US gun debate is obsessed with "good guys" and "bad guys".

From what I've heard from Trump, it seems to be Good Guys v. Mad Guys.

He blames all these mass shootings on people with mental health problems without, it seems to me, much evidence. Would he get away with that here, stigmatising people with MH issues as potentially being gun-toting, shoot-em-up killers?

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, skygod said:

From what I've heard from Trump, it seems to be Good Guys v. Mad Guys.

He blames all these mass shootings on people with mental health problems without, it seems to me, much evidence. Would he get away with that here, stigmatising people with MH issues as potentially being gun-toting, shoot-em-up killers?

No.  Across the board people here are better educated, more liberal and less religious than in the USA.   In the history of the world, as countries become more economically developed, they in turn become less religious.  The exception to this is the USA.   Trump would also have to stand up and justify policy in PMQ's weekly, instead of this tweeting nonsense.  He'd have been found out long before he got anywhere near the top job in the UK.

Edited by RAG
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24 minutes ago, skygod said:

He blames all these mass shootings on people with mental health problems without, it seems to me, much evidence.

Would you not consider the intent to slaughter as many human beings as possible in a short a time as possible as fairly clear evidence of a mental disorder of some kind?

Where I have a problem is that Trump's solution to mental health problems is to shoot the person who is unwell. That sounds like something from the middle ages. Surely the educated approach to people with such serious mental health issues would be to make bloody well sure they are unable to harm themselves or anyone else.

As for the religious (presumably you mean Christian?) basis for everybody to go around tooled up, someone is going to have to remind me which chapter of The Gospels the 2nd Amendment is based on. 

 

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23 minutes ago, gdevoy said:

As for the religious (presumably you mean Christian?) basis for everybody to go around tooled up, someone is going to have to remind me which chapter of The Gospels the 2nd Amendment is based on. 

Heaven/Hell in religion. Good Guys/Bad Guys in the movies. Is the same simplistic, polarised concept of morality, so ingrained in American culture every red neck understands.  A message so simple, it can usually fit in 140 characters on twitter!

Trump, (being a TV pro) plays his dumbed down core audience well.

Edited by RAG
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9 minutes ago, RAG said:

Heaven/Hell in religion. 

Fair point, there is loads of Genocide and Wrath of God in the Old Testament. Penalty for homosexuality or indeed working on a Sunday is death. Having sex with your own children is OK though. If you want to see what a modern US society based on the Old Testament might look like you could real The Handmaid's Tale.

If you are going to base your morality on the Old testament then you really will find Hell on Earth. 

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