"Taking a knee"

[Wrangodog]

16 minutes ago, andy123 said:

TBF I don't do Facebook/twitter thought all the old firm s**te was just religious pish they went on about. Why are old firm fans racist.? Genuine question 

It's called Oldfirmfacts but most of the time it takes the rip out of both of them, but mostly Sevco because they are a basket case and some of their fans are so thick, sectarian, and racist. 

[bute-killiefan]

14 minutes ago, andy123 said:

No but I am English. Now I could say I get stick for been English but I take it as banter. Suppose somebody else could take it as something more. Work with a couple of Black people they always say they find folk here OK and don't have any issues

'Of the 500-plus black and ethnic minority individuals surveyed by the University of Edinburgh and the pollster Survation, more than a quarter of those surveyed by the University of Edinburgh and the pollster Survation said that they believed incidents of discrimination in Scotland had become more frequent.

These incidents may include discrimination expressed through name-calling, inappropriate language, encounters on public transport and prejudice in the workplace, such as prejudicial treatment by employers.

Of those who said they had experienced discrimination, 25 per cent reported it had happened while applying for a job. 18 per cent said that racial discrimination had affected their chances of promotion, while and another 18 per cent said it had affected their attempts to secure equal pay.

35 per cent confirmed that they had experienced discrimination while using transport services, and a further 20 per cent while accessing healthcare.

An overwhelming majority of 89 per cent of had suffered discrimination felt that it was because of their perceived ethnicity. 66 per cent meanwhile attributed their experiences with discrimination to their perceived religion.

Among those surveyed, 37 per cent of those with a black African Caribbean heritage said they had experienced discrimination in Scotland in the past two years, as had 35 per cent of those with Asian heritage and 24 per cent of mixed heritage respondents.

 

15 minutes ago, andy123 said:

Work with a couple of Black people they always say they find folk here OK and don't have any issues

The research also revealed that 49 per cent of those who experienced discrimination did not report it – a decrease from the more than 60 per cent found in recent years, while may indicate a growing willingness to register complaints.

 

https://sourcenews.scot/scotland-is-not-immune-from-hatred-research-shows-persistent-levels-of-discrimination-against-black-and-ethnic-minority-scots/

[andy123]

4 minutes ago, skygod said:

Do you think maybe your black colleagues take things said as being banter?

Because, like Seedsy and most of us, they don't like confrontation?

Just a thought.

 

Possibly but that would mean the things said to me are also racist then. I much prefer to think its banter and Scottish people don't actually hate the English or theu mean the things they say

[bute-killiefan]

I'm going to stress, I'm not calling @andy123 racist or some kind of apologist. Clearly you're not.

You've been on the receiving end, even if you say it's all banter.

[andy123]

2 minutes ago, bute-killiefan said:

'Of the 500-plus black and ethnic minority individuals surveyed by the University of Edinburgh and the pollster Survation, more than a quarter of those surveyed by the University of Edinburgh and the pollster Survation said that they believed incidents of discrimination in Scotland had become more frequent.

These incidents may include discrimination expressed through name-calling, inappropriate language, encounters on public transport and prejudice in the workplace, such as prejudicial treatment by employers.

Of those who said they had experienced discrimination, 25 per cent reported it had happened while applying for a job. 18 per cent said that racial discrimination had affected their chances of promotion, while and another 18 per cent said it had affected their attempts to secure equal pay.

35 per cent confirmed that they had experienced discrimination while using transport services, and a further 20 per cent while accessing healthcare.

An overwhelming majority of 89 per cent of had suffered discrimination felt that it was because of their perceived ethnicity. 66 per cent meanwhile attributed their experiences with discrimination to their perceived religion.

Among those surveyed, 37 per cent of those with a black African Caribbean heritage said they had experienced discrimination in Scotland in the past two years, as had 35 per cent of those with Asian heritage and 24 per cent of mixed heritage respondents.

 

The research also revealed that 49 per cent of those who experienced discrimination did not report it – a decrease from the more than 60 per cent found in recent years, while may indicate a growing willingness to register complaints.

 

https://sourcenews.scot/scotland-is-not-immune-from-hatred-research-shows-persistent-levels-of-discrimination-against-black-and-ethnic-minority-scots/

fair enough then. I would say I've been a victim of some of the above. But as previously said I've just taken it as banter and thought no more about it.

[bute-killiefan]

1 minute ago, andy123 said:

fair enough then. I would say I've been a victim of some of the above. But as previously said I've just taken it as banter and thought no more about it.

Fair enough. I'm sad you had to deal with it. I'm glad it hasn't bothered you.

 

[Fudger]

1 hour ago, seedsy said:

If taking the knee is for equality, why wouldn't you do it? 

Because someone in America decided this was a good way to show solidarity we must insist everyone does it now? A very dangerous route to go down in my opinion. 

BTW I’m not opposed to the act in the slightest, what I am opposed to is insisting people do it then crucifying anyone who dares suggest they don’t want to. It should be a personal choice. 

[andy123]

1 minute ago, bute-killiefan said:

I'm going to stress, I'm not calling @andy123 racist or some kind of apologist. Clearly you're not.

You've been on the receiving end, even if you say it's all banter.

Thanks. Im sure lots of people on here have had issues when down south. The old "its just abit of banter"  Sad days that someone's skin colour would make people treat them differently 

[skygod]

5 minutes ago, Killieboykfc said:

Shut your f**kin mouth and don’t try and say this country doesn’t have a racism issue. 

Can you not make your point without being abusive? 

It kind of flies in the face of the points we’ve been debating. 

 

[bute-killiefan]

Just now, Fudger said:

Because someone in America decided this was a good way to show solidarity we must insist everyone does it now? A very dangerous route to go down in my opinion. 

BTW I’m not opposed to the act in the slightest, what I am opposed to is insisting people do it then crucifying anyone who dares suggest they don’t want to. It should be a personal choice. 

No one is insisting people do it. Dyer literally says the opposite

[Fudger]

Just now, bute-killiefan said:

No one is insisting people do it. Dyer literally says the opposite

Was answering on society in general, not Alex Dyer or us as a club specifically. 

[Killieboykfc]

1 minute ago, skygod said:

Can you not make your point without being abusive? 

It kind of flies in the face of the points we’ve been debating. 

 

I can aye, I choose not to tho when it’s involving folk who are downplaying an issue as serious as racism. 
 

Thanks for your input though. 

[andy123]

12 minutes ago, Killieboykfc said:

This was just one of several replies to our manager saying he supports people taking the knee. 
 

Shut your f**kin mouth and don’t try and say this country doesn’t have a racism issue. You are making yourself come across even worse than normal. 

Ha calm down its you coming across like an idiot not me. Im allowed my opinion and I haven't seen issues up here. 

The person who wrote that vile, is he from Scotland? is his address on his post? Could be from England/Wales/Ireland. 

[Killieboykfc]

Just now, andy123 said:

Ha calm down its you coming across like an idiot not me. Im allowed my opinion and I haven't seen issues up here. 

The person who wrote that vile, is he from Scotland? is his address on his post? Could be from England/Wales/Ireland. 

He is from Scotland aye. Are you seriously still trying to say that there is no issues with racism in this country? Take your head out of the sand. 
 

We live in a country where corner shops are constantly referred to as racist slurs, same with Chinese take aways. I don’t know why you are even trying to argue otherwise. 

[andy123]

Maybe I miss alot of racism as I don't go on social media. Life is so much better not having to read all that s**te. 

Has a major impact on peoples Mental health, is something I will try to teach my children to stay away from. I dont see any positives from it 

[Killieboykfc]

Are you now trying to claim that it only exists on social media? 
 

You just seem like an absolute racist apologist. Why can you not just admit that there’s a problem in this country?

[Guff92]

Just now, andy123 said:

Maybe I miss alot of racism as I don't go on social media. Life is so much better not having to read all that s**te. 

Has a major impact on peoples Mental health, is something I will try to teach my children to stay away from. I dont see any positives from it 

You don’t need social media to know there is a racism problem in Scotland. Not quite as rife as the bigotry but it’s still a huge problem and well done to Alex Dyer for wanting to show solidarity.

The fact that this thread has turned into yet another argument is quite worrying.

Frightening.

[andy123]

Just now, Killieboykfc said:

He is from Scotland aye. Are you seriously still trying to say that there is no issues with racism in this country? Take your head out of the sand. 
 

We live in a country where corner shops are constantly referred to as racist slurs, same with Chinese take aways. I don’t know why you are even trying to argue otherwise. 

Well not from the folk i hang around with. Maybe I dont see much of it as I chose not to associate with filth like that. 

In my defence I didn't realise stuff like that was still getting posted on social media. Whats app and this forum is the only social media I take part in. 

I agree that is totally out of order and should be reported to the police. 

But my point was the taking of the knee in my opinion is political as its regarding what happened in America. Black lives matter as much as any other life who gives a feck what colour you are or where you are born

[andy123]

2 minutes ago, Killieboykfc said:

Are you now trying to claim that it only exists on social media? 
 

You just seem like an absolute racist apologist. Why can you not just admit that there’s a problem in this country?

No im not saying that. Im saying I dont personally see much racism. Im obviously shielded from social media stuff, Live in irvine isn't many black people about but never really wondered why that is!!! So is it because people in ayrshire are racist and they are scared to live here. Really hope that isn't the case 

[carpetfitter]

1 hour ago, andy123 said:

I dont think we have an issue in Scotland regarding racism so dont know why we are highlighting black lives matter. 

Feels like we are saying we have an issue here to like other countries and we have to promote black lives matter to change how people think/act etc

Sheku Bayoh - died in police custody. Main copper a racist. Surjit Chhokar - murdered by racists in Wishaw etc Scotland’s leading human rights lawyer had his teeth bashed into ground by cops - one said ‘That’s what happens to black boys with big mouths’. Etc 

[carpetfitter]

25 minutes ago, andy123 said:

Ha calm down its you coming across like an idiot not me. Im allowed my opinion and I haven't seen issues up here. 

The person who wrote that vile, is he from Scotland? is his address on his post? Could be from England/Wales/Ireland. 

Have a look at Rangers Media - seems to be a large number who have this view

[carpetfitter]

Alex Dyer 100% correct. Total support this dignified principled man. 

[cammy2012]

3 hours ago, skygod said:

Kilmarnock boss Alex Dyer feels players should take the knee in support of the Black Lives Matter campaign “for as long as it takes to get the message out there”.

The Scottish Professional Football League announced on Tuesday that players will be given the chance to take a knee before kick-off when the new Scottish Premiership season gets under way this weekend.

In partnership with PFA Scotland and Show Racism the Red Card, the SPFL said players will also wear special t-shirts on the opening day to promote Scotland’s anti-racism charity.

When asked how long players should take a knee for, Dyer said: “As long as it takes to get the message out there. 

“It’s a choice as well by the way, I’m not saying everyone has to do it.

“If they feel like they don’t want to take the knee then it’s no problem. A black person shouldn’t discriminate against somebody who doesn’t want to take the knee, it’s their life.

“We like to see that people are responsive to it and if they take it on board, but if they don’t, fair enough. It’s not a major issue, everyone has a choice.” 

 

Dyer, whose side play at Hibernian in their opening game, signed a two-year deal in June to become Kilmarnock’s permanent manager. 

The former Blackpool, Oxford and Charlton defender had taken caretaker charge in December when Angelo Alessio was sacked. 

Seven new players have arrived at Rugby Park since Dyer led Killie to an eighth-placed finish last season, and another is expected to be announced soon.

“I’m just about to bring a goalkeeper in any time now,” said Dyer, who has already signed former Aberdeen goalkeeper Danny Rogers.

“Whether he’ll be ready for Saturday or not, we’ll have to wait and see, but there will be one in the building, definitely. 

“We also want to bring in (players) for another couple of positions, I don’t really want to say, but we’ll be bringing in one or two others.” 

This summer, 15 players who had been in Dyer’s first-team squad have either moved on or returned to their parent club.

Dyer added: “My aim is to stay in this league. I know it’s a bit boring, but it’s the honest truth.

“We’ve seen what happened to Hearts and no-one wants to be in that predicament.”

https://www.fourfourtwo.com/news/alex-dyer-urges-players-to-take-the-knee-for-as-long-as-it-takes-1596120621000

 

There is no legitimate reason to object to anyone showing support for #blm 

[cammy2012]

3 hours ago, skygod said:

It will be interesting to see what happens when fans are allowed back in.

I'm seeing quite a lot of opposition on Twitter from supporters of big English clubs. I imagine Rangers are the same.

 

Racists will be racists. Surprised?

[cammy2012]

2 hours ago, stewarty66 said:

Exactly this.

No one should be made to feel uncomfortable at work. 

Especially if they feel they are being pressured into making a political statement....

Oh dear. They live amongst us.