Next manager (under construction)

[ki11ie]

Cannot believe dyer is not out yet. 

[piffer]

3 minutes ago, ki11ie said:

Cannot believe dyer is not out yet. 

Are you surprised? The board have their eyes shut and fingers in their ears. Aside from Cathy’s update which is laughable when talking about current form we’ve heard nothing from the board for ages.

I want him out but I believe Dyer will have a job until we are adrift at the bottom of the table. 

[killie1961]

2 hours ago, trenwick said:

unless the board get brave or dyer does the right thing then its only him that has to do the big job of organising the shamble into defending, scoring, creating & being disciplined on the pitch

Maybe Paul Clarke could recommend some one to Billy the last one did not do too badly?

[historyman]

2 hours ago, Beaker71 said:

The fact that there is a big job to be done, is exactly the reason none of these guys are right for it.

Its not delusions of grandeur  its not wanting another hopeless diddy of a manager in our dugout.

Can you give some suggestions? Guys like Steve Clarke don’t come along very often. 

[historyman]

1 hour ago, Galdunc11 said:

We don’t know if Holt is the long term man for the job but I always thought he came across well in aftermatch interviews. Would we approach him but for the Killie connection? Probably not but if we need a candidate that would probably say yes and be available immediately and would be prepared to do a Hughes and initially accept a six month contract, why not? Are we going do do much better in the current health crisis? 

I’ve always got the feeling that Holt would crawl over broken glass for the Killie job. 

[Gaz of the 20/20]

On 10/18/2020 at 8:47 AM, Skora11 said:

This is a good thread. A particular favourite of mine from if. 

Out of interest what’s the win %age for Dyer as a manager when he was appointed full time? Sure he will now have flew up a few places after recent results.

This aged well ?

[C4mmy31]

1 hour ago, killie1961 said:

Maybe Paul Clarke could recommend some one to Billy the last one did not do too badly?

He'd probably do a better job himself....

[Twonky65]

9 hours ago, killie1961 said:

Maybe Paul Clarke could recommend some one to Billy the last one did not do too badly?

He did a great job with the youth teams back in the day brining through boydy, jacko, naisy, Gary McDonald, Canero, Fowler and a few others.

 

we could do worse...

[ParkHotel]

12 hours ago, piffer said:

Are you surprised? The board have their eyes shut and fingers in their ears. Aside from Cathy’s update which is laughable when talking about current form we’ve heard nothing from the board for ages.

I want him out but I believe Dyer will have a job until we are adrift at the bottom of the table. 

Ingrate.

And how is Cathy's update laughable? You won't get comment like that on what's happening from many of the other clubs in the top division. The other two are probably not saying much because they are too busy putting their hands in their pockets to keep YOUR f**king club alive. Probably embarrassed by the lack of support both financially and otherwise by the keyboard warrior brigade. Easy to sling mud when you're not on the front line. Easy to dictate what should happen when you are not paying for it.

The board are probably doing the best they can given the extenuating circumstances and finding a manager like Steve Clarke is not something that happens often, we waited 50 years for it and we are demanding more of the same when the world is in meltdown. They took a chance on Dyer and it looks like its not working, they now have to resolve that. It could be another 50 years before we find a Steve Clarke, just the same as 99% of other clubs that are not rolling in it.

We'll support you ever more, unless everything isn't happening exactly the way we want it, unless you guarantee a manager that will see us challenge at the top of the league, unless you sign more and better players, unless you take on the SPL and their cronies and win, unless..........

[Beaker71]

12 hours ago, historyman said:

Can you give some suggestions? Guys like Steve Clarke don’t come along very often. 

Tommy Wright, done a great job at a smaller club on a smaller budget with a smaller squad.  Knows the league and the budgetary tricks to get tje best out of what we have.

[ParkHotel]

3 minutes ago, Beaker71 said:

Tommy Wright, done a great job at a smaller club on a smaller budget with a smaller squad.  Knows the league and the budgetary tricks to get tje best out of what we have.

Hates synthetic pitches - next.

[Silent Bob]

Doubt we can afford to make a change so can’t see it happening unless we are removing Dyer and replacing him with Fowler who is already employed by the club.

[FanWithaTypewritter]

4 minutes ago, Silent Bob said:

Doubt we can afford to make a change so can’t see it happening unless we are removing Dyer and replacing him with Fowler who is already employed by the club.

That until the end of the season wouldn’t come as a shock! 

[chubbs]

When things were going great under Clarke we heard from Bowie and Phylis a few times ... now they are nowhere to be seen.  Remember they are the ones who ignored the fairly obvious signs that Clarke was leaving.... they are the ones who dragged their heels looking for a replacement ... they are the ones who then sacked the manager after 5 months .... they are the ones who appointed his replacement despite him losing all 3 games whilst caretaker ... they are the ones who then gave him an extended contract for picking up 10 pts out of 36.

 

So yeah ... fingers in ears, heads in the sand sounds about right.

[piffer]

20 minutes ago, ParkHotel said:

Ingrate.

And how is Cathy's update laughable? You won't get comment like that on what's happening from many of the other clubs in the top division. The other two are probably not saying much because they are too busy putting their hands in their pockets to keep YOUR f**king club alive. Probably embarrassed by the lack of support both financially and otherwise by the keyboard warrior brigade. Easy to sling mud when you're not on the front line. Easy to dictate what should happen when you are not paying for it.

The board are probably doing the best they can given the extenuating circumstances and finding a manager like Steve Clarke is not something that happens often, we waited 50 years for it and we are demanding more of the same when the world is in meltdown. They took a chance on Dyer and it looks like its not working, they now have to resolve that. It could be another 50 years before we find a Steve Clarke, just the same as 99% of other clubs that are not rolling in it.

We'll support you ever more, unless everything isn't happening exactly the way we want it, unless you guarantee a manager that will see us challenge at the top of the league, unless you sign more and better players, unless you take on the SPL and their cronies and win, unless..........

I don’t like the way Cathy talks about the first team football side. I always feel the politician in her comes out. Doesn’t want to upset anyone. Not asking her to slaughter players or manager but “not as successful as we hoped” is pish talk. That’s why I found it laughable. You can say that at the end of every game you don’t win 10-0.

I have the utmost respect for everything Billy, Phyllis and Cathy are doing to keep the club going. As @chubbssays though we heard from them a lot more during the good times. I want to hear more now than I did then. How are the club doing? Is there more that can be done by punters to help?

Through no fault of her own Cathy is still seen as divisive by a lot of support as is the trust. Sometimes we need to hear from the others as well. 

[historyman]

41 minutes ago, Beaker71 said:

Tommy Wright, done a great job at a smaller club on a smaller budget with a smaller squad.  Knows the league and the budgetary tricks to get tje best out of what we have.

Would be happy with Wright. If we don’t approach him to sound him out then we are missing an opportunity. 

[chubbs]

2 minutes ago, historyman said:

Would be happy with Wright. If we don’t approach him to sound him out then we are missing an opportunity. 

If he knocks us back then he knocks us back .... but we must at least ask the question.

[Cill Mheàrnaig]

40 minutes ago, ParkHotel said:

Ingrate.

And how is Cathy's update laughable? You won't get comment like that on what's happening from many of the other clubs in the top division. The other two are probably not saying much because they are too busy putting their hands in their pockets to keep YOUR f**king club alive. Probably embarrassed by the lack of support both financially and otherwise by the keyboard warrior brigade. Easy to sling mud when you're not on the front line. Easy to dictate what should happen when you are not paying for it.

The board are probably doing the best they can given the extenuating circumstances and finding a manager like Steve Clarke is not something that happens often, we waited 50 years for it and we are demanding more of the same when the world is in meltdown. They took a chance on Dyer and it looks like its not working, they now have to resolve that. It could be another 50 years before we find a Steve Clarke, just the same as 99% of other clubs that are not rolling in it.

We'll support you ever more, unless everything isn't happening exactly the way we want it, unless you guarantee a manager that will see us challenge at the top of the league, unless you sign more and better players, unless you take on the SPL and their cronies and win, unless..........

Maybe I've just missed it, but I've honestly not seen anyone say we should be getting a Clarke-level manager in? The vast, vast majority seem to realise he was a once in a generation appointment.

However.. What people are saying is that there are managers with better records than Dyer, with more experience than Dyer and who would have a better chance of getting the team performing on a consistent basis.

It's pretty obvious to me that the players don't give that extra 5% when they are managed by someone who is pally towards them all. That 5% is often the difference between winning a game 2-1 or losing it 1-2 in the Premiership. The players feared and respected Steve Clarke and as so gave that little bit extra.

As said above, we won't get another Steve Clarke in the door but what we can do is get someone from the same mould. If Kilmarnock appointed Tommy Wright tomorrow e.g. and gave the assistants job to someone who can bridge the divide between players and management (an Alex Dyer type..) then I have no doubts the performances would steadily improve. Can anyone honestly say that they think we'd get 5 red cards under him? No chance. 

Quote

Easy to dictate what should happen when you are not paying for it.

But we are paying for it. Paying for it to the extent that any supporter can. Of course Bowie and the board are putting more money in than us, but that's sorta in their job description. Fans have bought season tickets with no hope of getting into a game; bought strips and retro tops by the bucketload; cleared the previous shop out of stock; went for lunch/drinks at the Killie Club etc etc etc

That IMO gives fans the right to be unhappy and the right to voice their frustration. In a normal season the boos after a lot of games would have told the board people's feelings but in 2020 boos have to be replaced by posts online. If the stick gets personal or abusive then that's too far and needs stamped out, but the vast vast majority of posts have been from genuine fans who are genuinely concerned about the future of the club under the current management. It's unfair to dismiss their views just because they're made online and by people who despite going through a tough year still contributed as much as they can to the club they love.

[ParkHotel]

7 minutes ago, piffer said:

I don’t like the way Cathy talks about the first team football side. I always feel the politician in her comes out. Doesn’t want to upset anyone. Not asking her to slaughter players or manager but “not as successful as we hoped” is pish talk. That’s why I found it laughable. You can say that at the end of every game you don’t win 10-0.

I have the utmost respect for everything Billy, Phyllis and Cathy are doing to keep the club going. As @chubbssays though we heard from them a lot more during the good times. I want to hear more now than I did then. How are the club doing? Is there more that can be done by punters to help?

Through no fault of her own Cathy is still seen as divisive by a lot of support as is the trust. Sometimes we need to hear from the others as well. 

A reasoned reply given my angry retorts, apologies for that, it just boils my blood reading so many 'expert' opinions by folk who would s**t their pants if they were in Billy Bowie's shoes. When have you ever heard a football club director be anything other than middle of the road when commenting on playing matters, at best you'll get is "not good enough", to expect anything other than that is living in cloud cuckoo land, it just doesn't happen and it won't start now.

We've never heard that much from Bowie unless the press have been chapping on his door for comment, he's not one for the press, and going by some of his comments that's probably why he keeps a low profile. To say he is invisible now is a misnomer, the same goes for McLeish who has always kept her head down too, probably due to problems in her personal life - which we have no right to intrude on.

Cathy, who is used to public speaking, gets pushed forward because of this, and also because its her job as the Trust's rep to report back to their members. What she can say is strictly controlled from a business and legal stance, that's company law, not just down to choice. I think its been made abundantly clear that the club need punters to help as much as they can with financial support, if anyone can't see that they are choosing to ignore the obvious.

You might be right that the Trust are still seen as divisive, but I'll tell you this, I have no time for fans of such opinion, they are being bloody minded and cutting their own noses off. The Trust are the third biggest shareholder in the club and its owned and operated by the fans, they've put more money in than anyone other than the largest shareholders and do it all for nothing but the benefit of the club. Anyone can be a member, anyone can be involved, they haven't got a case to answer to the doubters who are dinosaurs that are heading, along with their opinions, to extinction.

The Board now need to look at the manager's position as it has got to the stage that we can see things are not clicking as they should. They need to be professional about it and not react the way they did with Alessio when they caved to the demands of a groundswell of supporters opinions, that will have been a lesson learned. They also need to look at expanding the board and bringing on more people with different skill sets, including a chairman to be a focal point, in my opinion for what its worth that's been their biggest failing and as much as I respect Billy, ultimately that's his responsibility and something he has to address.

[historyman]

40 minutes ago, chubbs said:

When things were going great under Clarke we heard from Bowie and Phylis a few times ... now they are nowhere to be seen.  Remember they are the ones who ignored the fairly obvious signs that Clarke was leaving.... they are the ones who dragged their heels looking for a replacement ... they are the ones who then sacked the manager after 5 months .... they are the ones who appointed his replacement despite him losing all 3 games whilst caretaker ... they are the ones who then gave him an extended contract for picking up 10 pts out of 36.

 

So yeah ... fingers in ears, heads in the sand sounds about right.

Bowie was very prominent in the media when we were flying high under Clarke and when we appointed Alessio but I can’t remember the last time I heard him. 
It was particularly disappointing when he had nothing to say about the forfeited game. I don’t particularly like him but Cormack at Aberdeen is always pushing his club’s agenda whenever he can. 

[DG5]

3 hours ago, Twonky65 said:

He did a great job with the youth teams back in the day brining through boydy, jacko, naisy, Gary McDonald, Canero, Fowler and a few others.

 

we could do worse...

I think Alan Robertson  also had a big hand in the progress of the players you named. And  don't forget L McCulloch brought in some good players but couldn't manage the team.  Just because you can spot potential in a player it doesn't mean U can manage. 

[skygod]

Supporters are putting money into the club via season tickets, Killie TV, TiK, Killie Care Fund Lottery, shirt sponsorship, merchandise and the Killie Club when available.

We would all like to do more but times are hard and getting harder.

I said recently I’d like to see the club seek new investment. The board might like the set-up the way it is but, as custodians of the club, they have to consider what is in its best interests and not just what suits them. 

 

Edited December 22, 2020 by skygod

[ParkHotel]

9 minutes ago, Cill Mheàrnaig said:

But we are paying for it. Paying for it to the extent that any supporter can. Of course Bowie and the board are putting more money in than us, but that's sorta in their job description. Fans have bought season tickets with no hope of getting into a game; bought strips and retro tops by the bucketload; cleared the previous shop out of stock; went for lunch/drinks at the Killie Club etc etc etc

Some of us are, but not enough of us, there are far too many who are making demands that they have little or no right to. Constantly putting your hand in your pocket definitely not in the job description of a football club director, you're watching too much TV, if that was the case there would be very few board members in board room around the world. I accept your point about fans buying season tickets with no hope of getting into games, let's see how many demand to get in next year for free before we comment any further on that though. The Killie Club chose not to open back up when we went back down to Tier three because of the lack of numbers they had previously, the shops shelves have not been cleared of any items other than a few, making stuff up doesn't back up the point you are trying to make.

[ParkHotel]

8 minutes ago, historyman said:

Bowie was very prominent in the media when we were flying high under Clarke and when we appointed Alessio but I can’t remember the last time I heard him. 
It was particularly disappointing when he had nothing to say about the forfeited game. I don’t particularly like him but Cormack at Aberdeen is always pushing his club’s agenda whenever he can. 

He wasn't.

Am I living in some sort of alternate universe here? He was in the news a couple of times when the media were looking for comments. When the club was doing great the media are all over us and that's why they wanted to talk to the majority shareholder because the viewed him as the de facto chairman. If they approached him now he'd probably go on the TV again. Face the fact that now Steve Clarke has gone and we're back among the eight other perennial strugglers, no one gives a s**t about us, they are not interested, hence no one getting seen on telly. That's how the press operate.

[ParkHotel]

9 minutes ago, skygod said:

Supporters are putting money into the club via season tickets, Killie TV, TiK, Killie Care Fund Lottery, shirt sponsorship, merchandise and the Killie Club when available.

We would all like to do more but times are hard and getting harder.

I said recently I’d like to see the club seek new investment. The board might like the set-up the way it is but, as custodians of the club, they have to consider what is in its best interests and not just what suits them.

Not in the numbers they should be though. I heartily agree with what you say.

 

Now away to sulk. ?

Edited December 22, 2020 by ParkHotel