skygod Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 1 minute ago, historyman said: Ah yes, the good old 3-0 loss. The one rejected by the member clubs in TWO separate votes but which has now been imposed on Killie and St Mirren by Doncaster and his cronies. How can you not get the difference between a mandatory 3-0 forfeit for not fulfilling a fixture, which is what was voted on and rejected, and a 3-0 forfeit imposed after fault has been found? It’s like the Falkirk league cup match. You can’t fulfil a fixture - you forfeit. Motherwell in the league - you can’t fulfil the fixture, SPFL postpone pending an investigation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy123 Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, bute-killiefan said: Conveniently ignored everything else. Proving my point. It's weird you seem to interested in burying your club. Each to their own I'm not my own club admitted they have fecked up!!!!!! Folk on here trying to say we didn't break the 1 metre rule etc. Our rule was 2 metres all clubs knew about it and we have admitted wrong doing 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Superscot Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 1 hour ago, GCM said: Nine Dundee United players will miss their Scottish Premiership match at Livingston after being deemed close contacts of Covid-positive staff members. Yet game still ON. SPFL unreal Were we ordered by the SPFL not to play or did we say we couldn’t fulfil the fixture? If the latter, DU have presumably taken a punt on getting a better than 0-3 result. Helps the richer clubs, of course, as they have bigger squads. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Superscot Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 32 minutes ago, andy123 said: Who leeds? No its pennies to them. Not that much to killie either its 40k That’s probably a year’s wages for a fringe player. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, Jimmy Superscot said: Were we ordered by the SPFL not to play or did we say we couldn’t fulfil the fixture? https://kilmarnockfc.co.uk/news/club-statement-motherwell-match-postponed/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy123 Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Jimmy Superscot said: That’s probably a year’s wages for a fringe player. Well we must still have some of our half million in the bank from Europe we never spent -4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangodog Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 The tribunal report is on the SPFL website. People should download it, read it, then argue the toss, rather than quote small parts that the newspapers have lifted from it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siberian Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 Also club penalised by one less PPV game which could have amounted to a bit of money. Also, season ticket holders done out of another home game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Garvis Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 16 minutes ago, andy123 said: Why did the club allegedly hide information from the investigation. Our board sometimes dont handle things the way they should. But let's not get into that debate Ok it's time to pull on the big boy pants and tell everyone what the club "allegedly" try to hide from the investigation, Since you seem to be in the know. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy123 Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, Wrangodog said: The tribunal report is on the SPFL website. People should download it, read it, then argue the toss, rather than quote small parts that the newspapers have lifted from it. Thats why I said alleged. Does it not say in the report we broke social distancing rules- I'm sure i read that in the report 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy123 Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Siberian said: Also club penalised by one less PPV game which could have amounted to a bit of money. Also, season ticket holders done out of another home game. Demand a refund from the club? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Lurker Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 7 minutes ago, Jimmy Superscot said: That’s probably a year’s wages for a fringe player. That’s probably a week’s wages for a fringe player. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangodog Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 3 minutes ago, andy123 said: Thats why I said alleged. Does it not say in the report we broke social distancing rules- I'm sure i read that in the report Mr Milligan QC, for the club, accepted that there were these two clearly defined areas where there were “issues” for the club. He accepted that on the said bus trip to and from the fixture there was not adequate social distancing, though he stated that everyone had been wearing masks during the journey. He accepted that at the pre match meal the club had not ensured social distancing between those utilising the facility whilst eating, by excessive numbers eating (and receiving coaching) at any one table. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Siberian Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 Why would I demand a refund from the club if they want to play the game? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GCM Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 28 minutes ago, skygod said: We requested a postponement from the SPFL. The entire first team squad was self-isolating. We didn’t have enough players to play the fixture. What option was available? If AD wasn’t willing to play the youths against Falkirk on 6 October he wasn’t going to field them against Motherwell on 2 October. According to the statement at the time "NHS Ayrshire & Arran Test and Protect Team carried out COVID-19 contact tracing following the six confirmed positive tests at the club. As a result, the club has been advised by the local Problem Assessment Group that the whole playing squad should self-isolate for a 14-day period." My point is with a total of nine players being told to self isolate and 3/4 managerial staff, it appears that different rules apply with NHS Tayside. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mister Y Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 56 minutes ago, Wrangodog said: Noticeable that the ruling was released yesterday when it got lost in the media due to Celtic and Sevco playing and in the aftermath of their games in the press today. Very noticeable....and predictable!!!! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killieboykfc Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 1 hour ago, historyman said: Your entitled to your opinion but I think the penalty that has been imposed upon the club is an utter disgrace. We failed to fulfil a fixture during a global pandemic. So f***ing what. The governing body should be trying to help clubs not bloody give them even more problems in probably their most difficult time since the Second World War. But no, let’s punish them financially and by forfeiting games. That will really make things better and uphold the sporting integrity of the league. I honestly couldn’t think of the more stupid way for the SPFL to approach this. They have outdone themselves which is quite an achievement. Same goes for tomorrow - the Dundee Utd game should be postponed if they have so many players and the management team missing. Why not? What on earth is the big deal about playing a game at a later date? Instead they will have to field a much weakened team if they field a team at all. The whole thing beggars belief. Let’s punish clubs at precisely the team when they need the most support, help and understanding. Brilliant strategy guys. There’s not much more I can say because obviously some Killie fans are on board with this approach. To me it’s basically self-harming your own sport. I don’t disagree with you that the punishment is OTT, I literally said that. I don’t agree with your view that we haven’t done anything wrong really and are no worse than Celtic/Aberdeen. That’s the point I was making. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy123 Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 5 minutes ago, Wrangodog said: Mr Milligan QC, for the club, accepted that there were these two clearly defined areas where there were “issues” for the club. He accepted that on the said bus trip to and from the fixture there was not adequate social distancing, though he stated that everyone had been wearing masks during the journey. He accepted that at the pre match meal the club had not ensured social distancing between those utilising the facility whilst eating, by excessive numbers eating (and receiving coaching) at any one table. yes thats what I read. So we breached rules. not really sure why everyone is getting their knickers in a twist about it. We got on the bus and ate at the hilton i think without the correct social distancing in place 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrogate Peter Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 11 minutes ago, Siberian said: Also club penalised by one less PPV game which could have amounted to a bit of money. Also, season ticket holders done out of another home game. I think this is a good point. Notwithstanding the sound and fury yet again the last group to be considered are the fans! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 2 minutes ago, andy123 said: We got on the bus and ate at the hilton i think without the correct social distancing in place Has it been said anywhere if this happened on one or different occasions? No Hilton Hotel at Paisley or Glasgow Airport which rules out St Mirren on 26 September. Aberdeen on 12 September then? Or Rangers on 22 August? Unlikely we would go into Glasgow city centre for lunch. A Dons supporter aggrieved at their being hauled over the coals whistle blowing? Or maybe, as Zorro suggested, discovered by test & trace. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post historyman Posted December 4, 2020 Popular Post Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 19 minutes ago, skygod said: How can you not get the difference between a mandatory 3-0 forfeit for not fulfilling a fixture, which is what was voted on and rejected, and a 3-0 forfeit imposed after fault has been found? It’s like the Falkirk league cup match. You can’t fulfil a fixture - you forfeit. Motherwell in the league - you can’t fulfil the fixture, SPFL postpone pending an investigation. I am not as thick as you perhaps think I am. I get the difference fine but in most cases I expect they will be one in the same. I don’t think the clubs ever wanted 3-0 forfeits whatever the circumstances because it makes a mockery of the league and leaves the fans, the paying customers incensed. However, that is what they’ve got now. What a great season it will be if the champions, the runners-up, the European places and the relegation places are decided not on sporting merit but on which clubs have been lucky enough to avoid Covid outbreaks and subsequent forfeits Who would want to pay money to watch that competition? Certainly not me. How do you think it would go down if Dundee Utd didn’t play on Saturday and the subsequent SPFL investigation found they hadn’t breached the rules? Games decided by how thorough And competent the investigators are? In any case I think all of these investigations will be fundamentally flawed. You can prove a club did not follow the regulations but you cannot prove that any Covid outbreak resulted from those errors. There will always be doubt yet the SPFL are now judge, jury and executioner led by someone who basically proclaimed Killie’s guilt before the investigation even started. 3-0 defeats. What a joke. Keep severe punishments like that not for clubs trying to claw their way through their most challenging times since WWII. Instead keep punishments like that for real rule breakers like those who play game after game, season after season with improperly registered players and then shred a slew of documents (no allegedly in this case) when the tax man is at the door. Oh, wait a minute ... The governance of the game in this country is beyond parody. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killie1961 Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 23 hours ago, Dotaman said: I don’t have an issue with us facing some sanction for this. It’s the nature of the sanction that is the problem. All of these games could have been played by now. We could have subsequently faced a fine or points deduction. Rewarding Motherwell with 6 points (+6 g.d) without them kicking a ball is perverse. Looks like the club made mistakes but the punishment was too severe and no way should motherwell and hamilton benefit from this ,this was just to suck up to the Scottish Govt and they made an example of st mirren and ourselves 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post historyman Posted December 4, 2020 Popular Post Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 19 minutes ago, Killieboykfc said: I don’t disagree with you that the punishment is OTT, I literally said that. I don’t agree with your view that we haven’t done anything wrong really and are no worse than Celtic/Aberdeen. That’s the point I was making. I have never said we haven’t done anything wrong. i have never said we are no worse than Celtic or Aberdeen although I do think the actions of the Aberdeen players were disgraceful and nearly brought the whole league to an abrupt end. What I have said is that the sanction imposed on the club is wholly disproportionate, unfair, entirely unhelpful and rooted in punishment rather than trying to aid and support a member club during challenging and exceptional circumstances. In my industry we have all implemented the agreed protocols but all of us have still had Positive cases and therefore self-isolations. In all my life supporting the club I do not ever remember them forfeiting a game. I am sure there will be some but they will be few and far between. That’s how draconian and exceptional the sanction is. I find the whole thing totally disgusting. 22 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Malkmus Posted December 4, 2020 Popular Post Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 3 minutes ago, historyman said: I have never said we haven’t done anything wrong. i have never said we are no worse than Celtic or Aberdeen although I do think the actions of the Aberdeen players were disgraceful and nearly brought the whole league to an abrupt end. What I have said is that the sanction imposed on the club is wholly disproportionate, unfair, entirely unhelpful and rooted in punishment rather than trying to aid and support a member club during challenging and exceptional circumstances. In my industry we have all implemented the agreed protocols but all of us have still had Positive cases and therefore self-isolations. In all my life supporting the club I do not ever remember them forfeiting a game. I am sure there will be some but they will be few and far between. That’s how draconian and exceptional the sanction is. I find the whole thing totally disgusting. Very well said, I can't believe some of our own support cannot grasp how draconian, unfair and disproportionate the punishment is. We should be supporting our industries through this not be making an example of an easy target. 11 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted December 4, 2020 Report Share Posted December 4, 2020 (edited) 23 minutes ago, historyman said: What a great season it will be if the champions, the runners-up, the European places and the relegation places are decided not on sporting merit but on which clubs have been lucky enough to avoid Covid outbreaks and subsequent forfeits That is exactly what we all speculated on at the start of the season. Plus, of course, whether the season would actually reach its natural conclusion this time. We knew that all clubs would most likely be affected by the virus. The alternative was that the season was abandoned which would have seen most clubs wiped out. This season was always going to exceptional and subject to Covid 19. What we maybe didn't expect was that the SPFL would be so punitive of affected clubs. Perhaps they didn't plan on being, but I think everything changed when some players acted like fannies and the FM went ballistic. Edited December 4, 2020 by skygod 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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