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St Mirren Match Fred


C4mmy31

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2 minutes ago, Prahakillie said:

Possibly more important now with more subs being allowed and with the amount of games being played in a more compressed season. 

You look at some teams and it’s obvious some players have been told to play at 100% for an hour and then they’ll be subbed. We look like we’re trying to preserve energy so we can last ninety minutes. 

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Doesn't matter what we all think about it its a goal an own goal and it cost us 2 points today but as has been said a dreadful decision by Rodgers and how many times have we as supporters to witness late late goals against us at rugby park total sickened once again.

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1 hour ago, historyman said:

If it is the former it is ridiculous that the manager thinks we can defend a one goal lead - just look at the clean sheet stats he has in the SPFL. They are appalling. Compare them to SC and even AA. He should never be instructing them to sit on a one goal lead. We are not capable of doing so

I agree with you that I don't think Dyer has it and should be replaced - but I do think some of the (entirely justifiable) frustrations about things generally are getting to people's analysis of today in isolation. 

Its hardly 'ridiculous' to think we could sit on a lead when we damn near did it. They weren't peppering our goal, we looked comfortable and they didn't look like scoring at all. 

I would look at it differently if they were hitting the post, hitting the bar, we were scrambling balls off the line etc - but we were fairly comfortable I thought. 

Its naive perhaps, but I don't think it's ridiculous. 

In isolation, I think a change of shape today was just as likely to make us more likely to lose a goal as we've looked rotten in the others. And I don't think a like for like swap anywhere would have made a huge difference. 

Do we score a second with Kabamba beside Whitehall? I doubt it, and we lose a midfield body. Tsh for someone maybe? Sure, but we weren't losing the midfield battles so not sure how much that changes things. 

Maybe Pinnock for a bit for something different going forward? But then he's poor at defending and we were always going to have some of that to do with a team chasing. 

I would have like to have seen changes to try and break up the flow and make something different happen. But I don't think that's the reason we dropped points today, and I type that knowing there's reds aplenty to follow. 

We should have confidence that the professional footballers we have at the club can hold onto a lead at home against St Mirren. I find it hard to get too annoyed at Dyer for trusting in that. 

For the avoidance of any doubt - this is not to be read as a defence of Dyer generally, but I felt for him a bit today because I thought he did an awful lot right for a change. 

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13 minutes ago, Craigieboy said:

Kilmarnock need drop McKenzie next weekend face Hamilton Accies

He was fine, up to his usual standard today.

Got around the pitch well in the first half, although his end product is poor.

In the second half, we needed to play higher up the field but Rory was more concerned with stopping their full back. 

 

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Isn't it a wee bit depressing that we've tried to sit in and defend a one goal lead at home to St Mirren for the whole of the second half? Is that what we've become under AD? We've no devine right to just turn up and beat anyone, but surely, at home to our peers, we should have a wee bit more about us?

The Steve Clarke years have got us used to this style of negative football, what happened to trying to play with a bit of flair, trying to entertain, what happened to that? Really scunnered by the 'dire' football that we are witnessing, it would get football stopped.

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2 minutes ago, funky monkey said:

Isn't it a wee bit depressing that we've tried to sit in and defend a one goal lead at home to St Mirren for the whole of the second half? Is that what we've become under AD? We've no devine right to just turn up and beat anyone, but surely, at home to our peers, we should have a wee bit more about us?

The Steve Clarke years have got us used to this style of negative football, what happened to trying to play with a bit of flair, trying to entertain, what happened to that? Really scunnered by the 'dire' football that we are witnessing, it would get football stopped.

I don’t think we were sitting in. That would suggest we had a tactic to defend and maybe hit on the counter. Today we were pushed back and couldn’t react. 

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31 minutes ago, mitch14 said:

I agree with you that I don't think Dyer has it and should be replaced - but I do think some of the (entirely justifiable) frustrations about things generally are getting to people's analysis of today in isolation. 

Its hardly 'ridiculous' to think we could sit on a lead when we damn near did it. They weren't peppering our goal, we looked comfortable and they didn't look like scoring at all. 

I would look at it differently if they were hitting the post, hitting the bar, we were scrambling balls off the line etc - but we were fairly comfortable I thought. 

Its naive perhaps, but I don't think it's ridiculous. 

In isolation, I think a change of shape today was just as likely to make us more likely to lose a goal as we've looked rotten in the others. And I don't think a like for like swap anywhere would have made a huge difference. 

Do we score a second with Kabamba beside Whitehall? I doubt it, and we lose a midfield body. Tsh for someone maybe? Sure, but we weren't losing the midfield battles so not sure how much that changes things. 

Maybe Pinnock for a bit for something different going forward? But then he's poor at defending and we were always going to have some of that to do with a team chasing. 

I would have like to have seen changes to try and break up the flow and make something different happen. But I don't think that's the reason we dropped points today, and I type that knowing there's reds aplenty to follow. 

We should have confidence that the professional footballers we have at the club can hold onto a lead at home against St Mirren. I find it hard to get too annoyed at Dyer for trusting in that. 

For the avoidance of any doubt - this is not to be read as a defence of Dyer generally, but I felt for him a bit today because I thought he did an awful lot right for a change. 

If you look at how many games Dyer has managed Killie and how many times we’ve kept a clean sheet then I do think it is ridiculous to go with that strategy. It’s more a case of we damned near never do it The percentages must be about 80/20 or 4/1 against. 
All of the options you mentioned could have been tried and they would have brought fresh legs on the park. 

They didn’t really look like scoring (they’re not the leagues lowest scorers for nothing) but If you spend the whole of the second camped in your own half then you’re asking for trouble. I think our second half performance was dull, pedestrian, lacking in any ambition and cowardly. I think if any fans had been in the stadium they would have let the players and the manager know it. 

Edited by historyman
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1 hour ago, Jedi2 said:

Could be rose tinted specs as I can recall 'hanging on' against St.Mirren two years ago with a 2-1 lead, difference being they didn't get an equaliser that time.

Is 'game management' just about bringing subs on? (as has been said something which SC frequently didn't do, when leading 1-0. 2-1 either). Or is it pressing forward to get a 2nd goal? (something which didn't always happen with SC either). Or, is it about making sure that you have a shape which restricts the oppositions chances and areas of the pitch in which they can work in? (something we very much did do under SC, and, also for me, pretty much in the 2nd half today as well)

I accept the argument that we don't have an SC squad to manage games as effectively.....largely due to not having an out ball in a Jones type player to carry us up the pitch, or a Stewart one to create more when we do move forward)...however, we do still have Broadfoot, Findlay, Mulumbu, Power, McKenzie, Kiltie and Burke on the pitch.....7 players out of 11 from an SC squad. 

Still think we could do with a pacey winger, 2 forwards, cover for full back, a creative midfielder, and probably another keeper this month though.

People need to stop comparing our situation to when SC seen out 1 goal leads.

We currently are nothing like that team and the team has no self confidence or self belief, so we can't expect them to manage the game on the field. The manager has to help them out by disrupting play with subs etc

Our manager looks like a rabbit in the headlights, scared to make a change in case it doesn't pay off so we end up scrambling about trying to hold onto a result

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7 minutes ago, piffer said:

I don’t think we were sitting in. That would suggest we had a tactic to defend and maybe hit on the counter. Today we were pushed back and couldn’t react. 

Dyer said that he would have been happy with a point at home to Livi and we messed up. Holding onto 3 points at home to St Mirren would have been the stuff of dreams for him them, though we still messed up. What do you think he said to the players at half time to produce that second half of negative football?

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4 minutes ago, historyman said:

If you look at how many gamesDyer has managed Killie and how many times we’ve kept a clean sheet then I do think it is ridiculous to give with that strategy. The percentages must be about 80/20 or 4/1 against. 
All of the options you mentioned could have been tried and they would have brought fresh legs on the park. 

They didn’t really look like scoring (they’re not the leagues lowest scorers for nothing) but If you spend the whole of the second camped in your own half then you’re asking for trouble. I think our second half performance was dull, pedestrian, lacking in any ambition and cowardly. I think if any fans had been in the stadium they would have let the players and the manager know it. 

Spot on. Cowardly is a good way to describe it. Fans in the stadium wouldn't have put up with that. Shameful.

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7 minutes ago, Wee_Eck1979 said:

People need to stop comparing our situation to when SC seen out 1 goal leads.

We currently are nothing like that team and the team has no self confidence or self belief, so we can't expect them to manage the game on the field. The manager has to help them out by disrupting play with subs etc

Our manager looks like a rabbit in the headlights, scared to make a change in case it doesn't pay off so we end up scrambling about trying to hold onto a result

Dyer is still trying to replicate the SSC era, seems like that's all he knows. Yet, as you clearly note, we aren't that team any more, we are not capable of being organised to the same standard. We are dropping a lot of points trying to contain teams when we clearly can't, remember the days when we used to worry the opposition, seems like such a long time ago.

Edited by funky monkey
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18 minutes ago, historyman said:

If you look at how many gamesDyer has managed Killie and how many times we’ve kept a clean sheet then I do think it is ridiculous to give with that strategy. The percentages must be about 80/20 or 4/1 against. 
All of the options you mentioned could have been tried and they would have brought fresh legs on the park. 

They didn’t really look like scoring (they’re not the leagues lowest scorers for nothing) but If you spend the whole of the second camped in your own half then you’re asking for trouble. I think our second half performance was dull, pedestrian, lacking in any ambition and cowardly. I think if any fans had been in the stadium they would have let the players and the manager know it. 

I don't think the plan was to be camped in though. 

Based on the first half, I think it was reasonable to send them out and say more of the same. 

Saints up their play. Still reasonable to give them 10/15 mins to get back to where they were in the first half. 

When it's clear we aren't getting there, I'm not sure there's a right call on what to do next. 

Their defensive record is excellent and we can barely score from open play. So far from guaranteed that a change brings us a goal, especially with who's left on the bench. 

With Saints doing well, a major change in formation is risky. 

So Dyer chose to try and hold what we had for the last quarter of the game. 

I don't see that as a ridiculous decision compared with the others. And, in a round about way, we proved we had the players to do that aside from the one between the sticks - but I don't think a manager can be legislating for a mistake like that. 

Different if it's clear that they are crossing all the time and our keeper is struggling with them. Or the keeper is having a howler generally. But that wasn't the case. 

I would have brought on fresh legs, but the lack of freshness wasn't what cost us the game. Nor was it the formation. Nor was it failing to react to something Saints were doing particularly well. 

We lost because of an inability to deal with a routine cross of the sort that was likely to come in from an away team chasing a game regardless of what changes Dyer made. 

Agree that Rugby Park would have been grumbling at that second half - I would have been one of them - but you have to weather a few difficult halves to win games in this league. 

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