Zorro Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 Lee Ashcroft is another that doesn’t make sense to me. The guy is 27 now. We got rid of him in 2016 after 66 league appearances. That’s a lot of appearances for a 21 -22 year old centre back. Were LC’s centre back signings a huge improvement? I can’t even remember half their names. Then we had guys like Osbourne, Scott Boyd, Addison, the return of Gorgeous Gordon Greer, Alex Bruce -did any of them contribute enough to make getting rid of Ashcroft the correct decision? Were they significantly better? Dependable is the kindest thing you could say about most of them imo. Maybe he wouldn’t have been a nailed on starter up against Ajer, Findlay Broadfoot (first time round) but he could definitely have learned from them. And he’d definitely have been a better option off the bench than some of the donkeys we’ve thrown on. We seem to be a bit hasty in judging our own young players and too quick in comparing them against youth players who are destined for bigger things. But there’s something to be said for bringing through the one club kind of players like Fowler at the expense of a quick financial gain from players like Kennedy. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorielus Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 38 minutes ago, dasboag said: but the setup is hardly conducive to progressive youth development Neither does the gaggle of diddies we've had as managers. There are no certainties in youth development of course, but imagine being coached as a young player on the fringes of first team football by Locke, AJ, Dyer, Millen, etc. rather than Mixu, Shiels, or Williamson who could both instill confidence in a player and genuinely improve their play with specific advice. Can you imagine if we stumbled across a Messi in one of our age groups and were relying on Andy Millen to recognise and develop that kind of talent? I wouldn't expect any of that list to teach a young player how to lace boots, let alone develop their potential. Player development is utterly crippled by our lack of long-term thinking - I was hoping that was one of the things Fowler would bring, though in fairness it's something that would take 2 or 3 seasons to really manifest any improvements. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C4mmy31 Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) Saying he has the right to answer then refusing to go into detail.... He's an absolute fraud imho. Edited May 24, 2021 by C4mmy31 -4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclean07 Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 14 minutes ago, C4mmy31 said: Saying he has the right to answer then refusing to go into detail.... He's an absolute fraud imho. Sounds like he will after tonight. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harrogate Peter Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 13 minutes ago, Mclean07 said: Sounds like he will after tonight. If he's holding off until after tonight that's showing the club and supporters a hell of a lot more respect than he has so far! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dasboag Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 15 minutes ago, Mclean07 said: Sounds like he will after tonight. I honestly hope he does - because even if hes in the wrong and being an arse about it - whatever has been going on, and not all around him as its been for the last 2 years - needs to change. We don't need anyone to blame (although I'm guilty of that myself), but we do need whatever it is out of the club and starting fresh - properly, hopefully still in the premier league 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) There’s a second comment from him on Twitter under that one. I think it’s fair to say that the written language barrier means there won’t be a huge amount to learn from it all. Those two tweets alone could be interpreted in about a dozen different ways. Hard to rush to judgment given that it could mean he’s had to leave for family reasons or various other things. Wish him all the best, irrespective, and I really don’t buy into the emerging narrative that he’s in any way let us down on the pitch this season. He was consistently getting m-o-m awards during that period when he was brought back into the team before inexplicably disappearing again. I think it’s reasonable enough to say that it’s a real shame it hasn’t worked out this season. I still maintain he was the best available midfielder at the club, but Wright has decided to go in another direction at the end of this season for whatever reason. Here’s hoping it pays off tonight! Edited May 24, 2021 by Travis 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mclean07 Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, Travis said: There’s a second comment under that one. I think it’s fair to say that the written language barrier means there won’t be a huge amount to learn from it all. Those two tweets alone could be interpreted in about a dozen different ways. Hard to rush to judgment given that it could mean he’s had to leave for family reasons or various other things. Wish him all the best, irrespective, and I really don’t buy into the emerging narrative that he’s in any way let us down on the pitch this season. He was consistently getting m-o-m awards during that period when he was brought back into the team before inexplicably disappearing again. I think it’s reasonable enough to say that it’s a real shame it hasn’t worked out this season. I still maintain he was the best available midfielder at the club, but Wright has decided to go in another direction at the end of this season for whatever reason. Here’s hoping it pays off tonight! It’s sometimes doesn’t feel right where players are trashed with little evidence. We turn on players very quickly at times without knowing the full story. 7 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Travis Posted May 24, 2021 Popular Post Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Mclean07 said: It’s sometimes doesn’t feel right where players are trashed with little evidence. We turn on players very quickly at times without knowing the full story. Indeed. And I always try to check myself before completely losing the plot with them. In part, the long-form filmed interview Gary Dicker did a while back really drove that home for me - it made the life of a footballer look a very isolated one. I’ve been very critical of Dicker for his poor performances this season, but balancing that I wouldn’t be surprised to hear that he’s struggled through with long-term injury or illness this season. Likewise with Mulumbu, I do feel there will be plenty sides to this story, and it’s probably not as simple as deciding someone’s the villain and slating them for it. Probably an example of two players it would be right to leave the club at the end of the season, but who’ve contributed to good times and ideally leave with best wishes and, more importantly, our league position secured. Edited May 24, 2021 by Travis 16 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cill Mheàrnaig Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 42 minutes ago, Travis said: Indeed. And I always try to check myself before completely losing the plot with them. In part, the long-form filmed interview Gary Dicker did a while back really drove that home for me - it made the life of a footballer look a very isolated one. I’ve been very critical of Dicker for his poor performances this season, but balancing that I wouldn’t be surprised to hear that he’s struggled through with long-term injury or illness this season. Likewise with Mulumbu, I do feel there will be plenty sides to this story, and it’s probably not as simple as deciding someone’s the villain and slating them for it. Probably an example of two players it would be right to leave the club at the end of the season, but who’ve contributed to good times and ideally leave with best wishes and, more importantly, our league position secured. Its definitely a lonely gig, especially if your family are the other side of the country. However.. We've been extremely good for Gary Dicker in terms of flexibility about visiting the South Coast and most importantly his career. Let's be honest, before joining us that was going one way and it had 'League of Ireland' painted in big bold letters. Dicker delivered by being a big part of the good times under Steve Clarke but his actions since then has been nothing short of a disgrace for a captain. And that's only taking into account the things we know for sure and can see on a Saturday. As for Youssouf - a desperation signing by a manager and board desperate for some positive press. I have no reason to doubt TW's version of events - mainly because, why would he lie about something days before our biggest match in years? I think it's been a case of Mulumbu came back expecting to be the first name on the team sheet and because of fitness or self-motivation (something his other managers have labelled at him) that hadn't happened. TW clearly doesn't believe that he's done enough to get himself fit, motivated or better integrated with the squad so hasn't played him - and rightly so. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travis Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, Cill Mheàrnaig said: Its definitely a lonely gig, especially if your family are the other side of the country. However.. We've been extremely good for Gary Dicker in terms of flexibility about visiting the South Coast and most importantly his career. Let's be honest, before joining us that was going one way and it had 'League of Ireland' painted in big bold letters. Dicker delivered by being a big part of the good times under Steve Clarke but his actions since then has been nothing short of a disgrace for a captain. And that's only taking into account the things we know for sure and can see on a Saturday. As for Youssouf - a desperation signing by a manager and board desperate for some positive press. I have no reason to doubt TW's version of events - mainly because, why would he lie about something days before our biggest match in years? I think it's been a case of Mulumbu came back expecting to be the first name on the team sheet and because of fitness or self-motivation (something his other managers have labelled at him) that hadn't happened. TW clearly doesn't believe that he's done enough to get himself fit, motivated or better integrated with the squad so hasn't played him - and rightly so. I was feeling charitable and trying to be nice about Dicker. Though I’m fairly clear his recent performances have been nothing short of honking and I’ll inevitably be less charitable if we’re relegated in a few hours. As for Mulumbu, I have no idea if Tommy Wright, Youssouf Mulumbu or anyone else’s version is the right one. But I suspect the reality is usually somewhere in the middle. If Mulumbu came back thinking he should be first choice, I couldn’t agree with him more! Particularly as he’s had to sit and endure some of our dismal midfield performances over the last few months. He always looked motivated when he played, always looked fitter than Dicker, always covered more of the park. I can’t think of a single performance that was anywhere short of a solid 7/10. There’s no way we can say that about some of our guaranteed starters, and we shouldn’t revise those performances now. It’s hard not to think some of the failure lies with a manager who hasn’t been able to get the best out of his best players. But of course there’s an element of personal responsibility too. We don’t know the full story of what has happened. It’s likely we’ll never will get more than one-sided snippets and I have no more or less reason to believe any of them. It’s all but irrelevant now in any case. Of course it’s for the best that we part ways and hopefully the players that the manager has invested trust in return on that investment tonight. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prahakillie Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Travis said: Indeed. And I always try to check myself before completely losing the plot with them. In part, the long-form filmed interview Gary Dicker did a while back really drove that home for me - it made the life of a footballer look a very isolated one. I’ve been very critical of Dicker for his poor performances this season, but balancing that I wouldn’t be surprised to hear that he’s struggled through with long-term injury or illness this season. I wouldn't mind and I'd sympathise but the problem I have is that he's playing every week. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanyon Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 7 minutes ago, Prahakillie said: I wouldn't mind and I'd sympathise but the problem I have is that he's playing every week. You’d have to also suggest he’s been ill or injured now for a couple of years judging by his performances. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Travis said: Hard to rush to judgment given that it could mean he’s had to leave for family reasons or various other things. I am reluctant to slate players without good reason but walking out on the club before two make-or-break matches without any explanation is unforgivable for me. If he has a genuine, compelling reason then let’s hear it. As you say, it’s irrelevant now - he won’t be back - but he and the club owe us closure. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuncD Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 13 minutes ago, skygod said: I am reluctant to slate players without good reason but walking out on the club before two make-or-break matches without any explanation is unforgivable for me. If he has a genuine, compelling reason then let’s hear it. As you say, it’s irrelevant now - he won’t be back - but he and the club owe us closure. Unforgivable? He hadn’t been getting picked so why should he give us an explanation? If I was him I’d rather an extra 2 weeks at home with the family. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killie89 Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, DuncD said: Unforgivable? He hadn’t been getting picked so why should he give us an explanation? If I was him I’d rather an extra 2 weeks at home with the family. We might have needed to use him, especially with Dicker possibly being injured. Unless he’s got a genuine personal reason, it couldn’t have been that hard to stick around for one more week to help the team if required in these two games. I’m not expecting him to bleed blue and white but I really thought after three spells at the club, during which he got fantastic support from the fans, he might have shown us a bit more respect. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cill Mheàrnaig Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 8 minutes ago, DuncD said: Unforgivable? He hadn’t been getting picked so why should he give us an explanation? If I was him I’d rather an extra 2 weeks at home with the family. Youssouf Mulumbu is a professional footballer. His job is to perform to the best of his abilities for the club that pays his wages. All you see from him is blue hearts and hashtags on Twitter but if he really cared for the club, in any way at all, he wouldn't leave before the two biggest games in Killie's recent history. Even if you're not playing regularly you should prepare as if you'll be picked and be ready to come on and influence things if given the opportunity. Its one of the first things you get instilled in you at boys club level. Stephen McGinn and Scott Allan e.g. - unable to play in the Scottish Cup Final (so they know they can't feature, unlike YM) but still turned up and helped out - both had headsets to the bench; there for their teammates etc. That's what a professional does. Even if YM had a valid reason to go back to France, you knock on your managers door or phone him and arrange a meeting face-to-face - you don't just take your gear and bugger off. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drmurray Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Cill Mheàrnaig said: Youssouf Mulumbu is a professional footballer. His job is to perform to the best of his abilities for the club that pays his wages. All you see from him is blue hearts and hashtags on Twitter but if he really cared for the club, in any way at all, he wouldn't leave before the two biggest games in Killie's recent history. Even if you're not playing regularly you should prepare as if you'll be picked and be ready to come on and influence things if given the opportunity. Its one of the first things you get instilled in you at boys club level. Stephen McGinn and Scott Allan e.g. - unable to play in the Scottish Cup Final (so they know they can't feature, unlike YM) but still turned up and helped out - both had headsets to the bench; there for their teammates etc. That's what a professional does. Even if YM had a valid reason to go back to France, you knock on your managers door or phone him and arrange a meeting face-to-face - you don't just take your gear and bugger off. 100% right. If YM had genuine urgent reasons to leave, knowing Killie we would have understood.. even more so if he wasn't likely to figure tonight from the start. On Thursday GD landed heavily on his ankle so you don't know what may have happened. You also don't sneak in and take all your kit .. bugger off.. and don't tell anyone but leave a message afterwards. The club reached out to have a meeting which could be the start of formal disciplinary action, we won't know, but he didn't turn up. If every player who didn't get picked but still was paid by the club threw out the toys, then half of the squads would quit. YM can spin it anyway he wants but its still unprofessional..who will touch him now. He's hardly kicked a ball in 2 seasons.. so big question marks over his desire to work and compete for a slot. BTW I was one of them shouting for him to get a chance and get fit playing week in week out.. but in what I saw, he was way off match fitness..like GD he looked to have slowed down a lot. I'll remember his first stint with great admiration... the rest I'll just try and forget. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 42 minutes ago, DuncD said: Unforgivable? He hadn’t been getting picked so why should he give us an explanation? If I was him I’d rather an extra 2 weeks at home with the family. You do come across like the sort who would welsh on a contract, to be fair. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bbk Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 First time round he was a revelation for our club but the rest not so much lets just remember him for what he did initially for us and wonder why such an unquestionable talent could down tools the way he did! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cill Mheàrnaig Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 The fact he has the cheek to say on Twitter that no manager has questioned his work ethic or commitment... First result on Google after searching 'Youssouf Mulumbu training' "Youssouf Mulumbu turned up late for his first day’s training and didn’t shine when the session got started." https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/what-youssouf-mulumbu-told-steve-13951612 He's clearly living in a wee fantasy world and that would be fine if he didn't start it all up again on the day of the match. -3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuncD Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 27 minutes ago, skygod said: You do come across like the sort who would welsh on a contract, to be fair. How so? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loudoun Killie Posted May 24, 2021 Report Share Posted May 24, 2021 3 hours ago, Travis said: There’s a second comment from him on Twitter under that one. I think it’s fair to say that the written language barrier means there won’t be a huge amount to learn from it all. Those two tweets alone could be interpreted in about a dozen different ways. Hard to rush to judgment given that it could mean he’s had to leave for family reasons or various other things. Wish him all the best, irrespective, and I really don’t buy into the emerging narrative that he’s in any way let us down on the pitch this season. He was consistently getting m-o-m awards during that period when he was brought back into the team before inexplicably disappearing again. I think it’s reasonable enough to say that it’s a real shame it hasn’t worked out this season. I still maintain he was the best available midfielder at the club, but Wright has decided to go in another direction at the end of this season for whatever reason. Here’s hoping it pays off tonight! Absolutely spot on! Well said. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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