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Colin Doyle


SCOOT KFC

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56 minutes ago, skygod said:

One good keeper, who has now retired, in fourteen years!

Money for old rope.

Harpur, Logan, Rascle, Letheren, Jaakkola, Brennan, Mackay, MacDonald, Koprivec, Rogers, Lyle....

Bell isn't just the best goalkeeper we have developed in fourteen years, he's the only one!

 

 

Jaakola is in the Finland squad at the euros to be fair 

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1 hour ago, skygod said:

One good keeper, who has now retired, in fourteen years!

Money for old rope.

Harpur, Logan, Rascle, Letheren, Jaakkola, Brennan, Mackay, MacDonald, Koprivec, Rogers, Lyle....

Bell isn't just the best goalkeeper we have developed in fourteen years, he's the only one!

 

 

Devlin Mackay was a fantastic goalkeeper very unlucky with injuries.

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19 minutes ago, Zorro said:

How could you leave Brown, Davies (I had to look him up), Fasan, Lyle,  Reguero, Rodgers, Robinson and Samson out? Billy worked with those guys too. 

Davies and Brown were on loan and I Ieft other clubs' keepers out.

Rogers and Lyle are there.

In fairness, Peter Logan developed into a good kitman.

 

 

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53 minutes ago, PrestersKtid said:

Jaakola is in the Finland squad at the euros to be fair 

There's probably not a lot of great goalkeepers (ice hockey apart) since Niemi Finnished. 

Would you take him back? Bristol Rovers finished bottom of League One so he'd probably jump at Killie.

No? Me neither.

 

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14 minutes ago, skygod said:

There's probably not a lot of great goalkeepers (ice hockey apart) since Niemi Finnished. 

Would you take him back? Bristol Rovers finished bottom of League One so he'd probably jump at Killie.

No? Me neither.

 

jaaskelainen Was a quality keeper.

probably wouldn’t have him back but he’s still made something of himself from that group of keepers you mentioned. 

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15 minutes ago, PrestersKtid said:

jaaskelainen Was a quality keeper.

probably wouldn’t have him back but he’s still made something of himself from that group of keepers you mentioned. 

I don't remember Jaakkola being a quality keeper. I do remember Paatalainen being a quality manager. 

Edited by carpetfitter
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9 hours ago, MarkyMark said:

Coupled with Doyle’s performances last season I’m not convinced that he is going to be able to coach goalkeepers to a good standard. If he has read the books about the mechanics of goalkeeping that Skydog refers to why couldn’t he put this learning into practice in his own game? Was it his physique? Age? 

Did anyone see anything in his performances that suggest he could teach others about positioning etc. I saw things in his performances to suggest that he couldn’t. 

As I said there must be more experienced goalkeeping coaches we can get that taking a gamble on Doyle and potentially having to call on him if there are injuries. 

First, I think we all agree that Doyle's time on the pitch is over. Hopefully TW agrees too, but in the interest of keeping other goalies (when they arrive) on their toes, he should never come out and say that Doyle won't play.

Secondly I disagree with your assertion about Doyle as a coach.

I’ve worked as an engineer in the private sector and as a teacher, and anyone quoting the old “those that can’t do...” can confidently be ignored as clueless or on the wind up (or both).

When the Japanese and South Korean economy collapsed back in the late 90s, the Scottish semiconductor industry was hit hard. Quite a lot of excellent candidates came into science teaching. As did some people regarded as hopeless duds. 

Thing is, regardless of their previous experience, some flourished whereas others floundered.

Teaching (and by extension, coaching) utilises a unique skillset that you won’t have seen Doyle show in a game. 

Most people haven't honed those skills, just as most people haven't honed the skills to do your job, and so they don’t recognise them in others. 

Think back to lockdown where many of you were whining and bitching about teaching one or two kids. Pffft! Think about all the praise heaped onto teachers when ordinary folk had to try to teach simple lessons to their weans.

I’m not saying teachers are unique in that. Everyone would be heaping praise on accountants if we all had to do our own accounts, or police officers if we all had to deal with what they have to for a couple of months.

Again, those who think it would be easy can be ignored because everything’s simple when you’re simple.

The point is, we have no clue how effective a coach Doyle would be just from seeing him on the pitch. I certainly don't, but TW must see something in him? 

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On 6/15/2021 at 9:27 AM, CB said:

 

Here's a thought... Would having someone like Doyle as a goalkeeping coach possibly prevent us getting a decent keeper in this year. 

Imagine you're an ambitious youngster, or even an experienced pro, you'd look at the infrastructure of the club before you sign a contract. 

It wasn't just killie fans that got to see the ability of our keepers last season 

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3 hours ago, casual observer said:

Looks like Doyle will be third choice behind Lyle at 2 with an as yet unknown number 1. Would take a lot of bad luck to be subjected to him in the first team as a starter I think. 

He was signed as a 3rd choice keeper last season. Behind Rogers and the boy on loan from Sheff Utd… There is not a f**king chance he should be on any sort of playing contract after his performances last season. Would rather put a youth player in there. 
 

If things went to s**t and we lost all our keepers we can sign an emergency loan. 
 

There should be no opportunity for Doyle to ever pull on a killie top again. He isn’t good enough.

I’d be very surprised if we signed him on a playing contract

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1 hour ago, gdevoy said:

I have renewed my ST because I am a Killie fan but I have to ssI have been totally underwhelmed by the clubs signing news so far and this thread just sums it up. 

Who do you expect us to be signing? All of the names in so far, are steady proven pro's at this level. Sanders is the exception. Build a solid spine and try get the flair/goal threat in next. Quite happy so far

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6 hours ago, Mogwai said:

First, I think we all agree that Doyle's time on the pitch is over. Hopefully TW agrees too, but in the interest of keeping other goalies (when they arrive) on their toes, he should never come out and say that Doyle won't play.

Secondly I disagree with your assertion about Doyle as a coach.

I’ve worked as an engineer in the private sector and as a teacher, and anyone quoting the old “those that can’t do...” can confidently be ignored as clueless or on the wind up (or both).

When the Japanese and South Korean economy collapsed back in the late 90s, the Scottish semiconductor industry was hit hard. Quite a lot of excellent candidates came into science teaching. As did some people regarded as hopeless duds. 

Thing is, regardless of their previous experience, some flourished whereas others floundered.

Teaching (and by extension, coaching) utilises a unique skillset that you won’t have seen Doyle show in a game. 

Most people haven't honed those skills, just as most people haven't honed the skills to do your job, and so they don’t recognise them in others. 

Think back to lockdown where many of you were whining and bitching about teaching one or two kids. Pffft! Think about all the praise heaped onto teachers when ordinary folk had to try to teach simple lessons to their weans.

I’m not saying teachers are unique in that. Everyone would be heaping praise on accountants if we all had to do our own accounts, or police officers if we all had to deal with what they have to for a couple of months.

Again, those who think it would be easy can be ignored because everything’s simple when you’re simple.

The point is, we have no clue how effective a coach Doyle would be just from seeing him on the pitch. I certainly don't, but TW must see something in him? 

Ah! that old engineering mantra?

Those who can do

Those who can't teach

I say engineering as I never heard it quoted by anyone who wasn’t an engineer or had engineering connections. It’s now more than 50 years since I first heard it, but surely it’s not only engineers that have used it ? Mind I often wondered what the basis for it was or if there was anything significant to back it up. 

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33 minutes ago, jbm1965 said:

Ah! that old engineering mantra?

Those who can do

Those who can't teach

I say engineering as I never heard it quoted by anyone who wasn’t an engineer or had engineering connections. It’s now more than 50 years since I first heard it, but surely it’s not only engineers that have used it ? Mind I often wondered what the basis for it was or if there was anything significant to back it up. 

Certainly heard it in Higher Education, in relation to folk who come into a Uni management/business school from a mid manager position in business or industry and bum themselves up about their amazing knowledge, but are s**te teachers, cos they know it all. 

Getting back to topic. Maybe the angst about 'immobile' will reduce when we sign a decent keeper - really hoping we do soon. 

Edited by carpetfitter
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I can’t believe this is actually a serious proposition that is being discussed. I assume the purpose of a goalkeeping coach is to improve the ability of the squad of the goalkeepers at the club by training and coaching them.

Some posts are saying that you don’t necessarily need to have been a good keeper to be a good coach. Let’s take one example, knowing when to come out and clear or knowing when to leave it to a defender. A pretty basic skill for a goalie. Take the infamous St. Mirren Scottish Cup tie, there must have been about five occasions he should have been out for the ball and commanded the area and didn’t do so. Not only that it looked like he didn’t communicate with the players to tell them what to do either. This total uncertainty actually led to conceding the goal that lost the game. 
How someone without even that level of ability can be considered to be capable of training and improving a younger keeper is beyond me. 

If the proposal is true then I think it’s a disgrace and the club has to think again. It’s a slap on the face to fans who watched that clown last season and has been rewarded with a contract. I wouldn’t trust him with putting the kit bag on the bus without dropping it. 

Edited by historyman
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A club of stature & ambition doesn’t recruit people with no prior experience or proven achievements for key positions.
 

Our manager, coaches, backroom & admin staff should all bring experience to us, & not be learning on the job at our expense. That part of their career should be behind them. 
 

And speaking of learning from prior experience, surely the club can’t be going down the Doyle route?

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1 hour ago, historyman said:

I can’t believe this is actually a serious proposition that is being discussed. I assume the purpose of a goalkeeping coach is to improve the ability of the squad of the goalkeepers at the club by training and coaching them.

Some posts are saying that you don’t necessarily need to have been a good keeper to be a good coach. Let’s take one example, knowing when to come out and clear or knowing when to leave it to a defender. A pretty basic skill for a goalie. Take the infamous St. Mirren Scottish Cup tie, there must have been about five occasions he should have been out for the ball and commanded the area and didn’t do so. Not only that it looked like he didn’t communicate with the players to tell them what to do either. This total uncertainty actually led to conceding the goal that lost the goal. 
How someone without even that level of ability can be considered to be capable of training and improving a younger keeper is beyond me. 

If the proposal is true then I think it’s a disgrace and the club has to think again. It’s a slap on the face to fans who watched that clown last season and has been rewarded with a contract. I wouldn’t trust him with putting the kit bag on the bus without dropping it. 

You really don’t need to have been great at something to be good at coaching it. There are numerous examples of some of the worlds best coaches never having played at a good level (Mourinho, Sarri, Nagelsmann etc). Also many of the best golf coaches in the world never played golf at an elite level. 

We continually have an opinion on football and think we know better than current football managers etc yet having nowhere near the same experience. As much as Colin Doyle was absolutely terrible last season, in the past he has played for his country and at the top level in England. I’m sure he would have worked under some top coaches and would have learned a thing or two.

Ideally would I want him to be signing? Not at all. However, if he is to be signed as a coach (that can play in an emergency) we’ve just got to hope he’s better at coaching than he is at playing now. 

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