Thebigguy68 Posted September 7, 2021 Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 Why are certain post getting deleted? I understand that certain limitations need to be applied but I’m unclear why some recent posts appear, then are removed? Yet others, seemingly more personal and/or offensive, are removed. Can someone post rules and guidelines for posts as it’s not clear why some posts are allowed and others are deleted. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Posted September 7, 2021 Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 2 minutes ago, Thebigguy68 said: Why are certain post getting deleted? I understand that certain limitations need to be applied but I’m unclear why some recent posts appear, then are removed? Yet others, seemingly more personal and/or offensive, are removed. Can someone post rules and guidelines for posts as it’s not clear why some posts are allowed and others are deleted. You're complaining that personal and/or offensive posts are being removed? O.....K 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebigguy68 Posted September 7, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 Just now, CB said: You're complaining that personal and/or offensive posts are being removed? O.....K I’m trying to understand what constitutes crossing the line? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kilMARKnock Posted September 7, 2021 Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 Hahahahahahahahahahaha 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kilMARKnock Posted September 7, 2021 Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 Bin the thread then CB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebigguy68 Posted September 7, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 Just now, kilMARKnock said: Bin the thread then CB Yes, censorship in action. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted September 7, 2021 Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 1 hour ago, Thebigguy68 said: Can someone post rules and guidelines for posts as it’s not clear why some posts are allowed and others are deleted. https://www.killiefc.com/forum/index.php?/guidelines/ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebigguy68 Posted September 7, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 6 minutes ago, skygod said: https://www.killiefc.com/forum/index.php?/guidelines/ Thanks. I’ll read and ensure compliance. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebigguy68 Posted September 7, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 7, 2021 Thanks. Dare I say a very basic set of guidelines. With a heavy dose of “in group”: sentiment. Question from a governance perspective, “who may raise the objection and what is the arbitration process?”. Just the controllers - on what basis? Personal views on football views? Morality? Legal guidelines?What it the basis for forum censorship? Seems any objection can be made without challenge? As below. “Anyone who feels that a posted message is objectionable is encouraged to notify an administrator or moderator of this forum immediately. We have the rights to remove objectionable content as time warrants, if we determine that removal is necessary” 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virtuocity Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorro Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 Ah this takes me back to the the good old days of Brianstorm… 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorielus Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 10 hours ago, Thebigguy68 said: Thanks. Dare I say a very basic set of guidelines. With a heavy dose of “in group”: sentiment. Question from a governance perspective, “who may raise the objection and what is the arbitration process?”. Just the controllers - on what basis? Personal views on football views? Morality? Legal guidelines?What it the basis for forum censorship? Seems any objection can be made without challenge? As below. “Anyone who feels that a posted message is objectionable is encouraged to notify an administrator or moderator of this forum immediately. We have the rights to remove objectionable content as time warrants, if we determine that removal is necessary” Now I don't know what was specifically deleted that you're unhappy with so I've no idea if this is relevant, but if it helps I got some clarity on this from CB a little while back on a specific example around my being rude to someone posting covid misinformation: - Posting covid misinformation that has directly and indirectly killed actual humans is entirely acceptable and within the rules - Calling someone an idiot for posting covid misinformation that has directly and indirectly killed actual humans is beyond the pale and will be removed. In other words, you can post (for example) provable false things, slanderous things, or links to illegal streams (if a mod decides they want to see that particular game anyway), but don't call people names. That's over the line. I'm really glad the site exists, and it's a great place to discuss football, but I would respectfully suggest the moderation team need to adjust the priorities as they seem to be a little skewed currently. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lroy Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 21 minutes ago, Lorielus said: Posting covid misinformation that has directly and indirectly killed actual humans is entirely acceptable and within the rules Calling someone an idiot for posting covid misinformation that has directly and indirectly killed actual humans is beyond the pale and will be removed. On at least 2 occasions in the past couple of weeks I've removed Covid misinformation when I have seen it. All personal abuse that is seen is removed and a warning issued. Off topic pot stirring nonsense will often be hidden when it seen to keep threads on topic. Sometimes they'll be split. When people are just adding nothing to a conversation, like just jumping in to shout snowflake, I'll often hide it. I remove what I see. I'm not omnipotent on the site, I have a full time job, this isn't what I do for a living, I don't read everything, certainly not on the politics forum. I rely on people reporting posts. That allows the moderation team to have a discussion about the consequences. There isn't a clear line about what is and isn't acceptable so discussions need to be had. We don't shout from the roof tops when we do these things. The last thing we want to happen is the forum to turn in to the Big Moderation Show. You (OP) feel there's over moderation, I bet more people (Lorielus) feel it's under moderated. If you are often finding yourself of the end of censorship then it might be time rethink the manner on which you post on this site. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorielus Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Lroy said: On at least 2 occasions in the past couple of weeks I've removed Covid misinformation when I have seen it. That may well be the case - obviously I don't see what you've removed unless I happen across it before you do, I'm just reiterating what I was told by CB, that covid misinformation is not against the rules. Quoting from his message to me directly: Covid misinformation is not against the rules, as far as I can tell. Perhaps the moderation team may need to align their approach and clarify the ruleset? I don't feel the site is undermoderated as such, I feel the moderation is not consistently or particular well applied at times (and I say that knowing full well it is by no means an easy path to tread). Removing posts that descend into personal insults over footballing disagreements is completely understandable, removing posts calling someone posting covid misinformation a moron for doing so, while leaving the misinformation posted, is...questionable at best. And I stress that the part in italics is the important part - I really don't care about whatever satisfaction "calling out" someone is supposed to give. Edit: Just to add, I'm really not looking for a fight so please don't feel the need to try to placate one random like me, it's your site and you get to run it how you see fit (and I'm happy to post on it for as long as it's around). Edited September 8, 2021 by Lorielus 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lroy Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 37 minutes ago, Lorielus said: Quoting from his message to me directly: Covid misinformation is not against the rules, as far as I can tell. Perhaps the moderation team may need to align their approach and clarify the ruleset? I mean, I suppose it isn't, but who foresaw that issue when we initially came up with ground rules. It should be and we should have agreed this, you are right. I'm sure I recently posted our process for warnings, I think that works well enough. I'll dig it out again when I have time. Perhaps we do need a better process for dealing with hiding posts; that is a bit haphazard/personal preference at the moment. I'll start a discussion with the team about how we can do that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorielus Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 55 minutes ago, Lroy said: I mean, I suppose it isn't, but who foresaw that issue when we initially came up with ground rules. It should be and we should have agreed this, you are right. I'm sure I recently posted our process for warnings, I think that works well enough. I'll dig it out again when I have time. Perhaps we do need a better process for dealing with hiding posts; that is a bit haphazard/personal preference at the moment. I'll start a discussion with the team about how we can do that. Thanks lot - that's really appreciated. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 Very reasonable explanation provided by Lroy. Moderation doesn't seem like an easy job and we all can make it easier if we exercise self-restraint. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorielus Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 Absolutely - it's also great that they're open to discussion on it too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mathematics Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 I generally don’t venture outwith the main subforum due to the amount of utter **** and all their wee online battles, so will only see stuff that is reported. If you don’t like a post and think it breaks the rules, report it. The mods then get an email notification. If you think, as @Lorielus has mentioned, that there’s scope for an update on the rules (such as misinformation) then tag the mods/site owner (the site doesn’t belong to the mods) and provide some reasoning. It’ll then be discussed, like adults, and a decision made. Although if misinformation is banned we might as well shut the politics forum. As @Lroy has alluded to, we’re not on here 24/7. I’ll go days or weeks without coming on. So report something you think breaks the rules. Also, don’t be a ********** or a ****** and spam the report function, as that’s pretty petty and will just get you banned for a bit. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lroy Posted September 8, 2021 Report Share Posted September 8, 2021 As I promised earlier, here's the notes we use for the warning point system Quote Anything that "breaks the rules" gets a warning point. Your first warning point is your warning. Warning points stick with you for 6 months A 0pt warning with a 24hr post-restriction can be given to people who just need to go and chill for a bit. If a user (including mod) reports a post, another mod must agree before a sanction is given out. When a user is given a warning they must be told clearly what their offence is, and made aware of what the next sanction will be. 1pt - Warning 2pt - Restricted from posting for 1 week. 3pt - Restricted from posting for 2 weeks. Content moderated for 1 week. 4th - Restricted from posting for 1 month. Content moderated for 1 week. 5th - We should aim to let nobody should get this far. Discuss sanctions at the time with the boss. And we've just agreed this process for hiding posts: If you see a post you think needs hidden, hide it and report it. (Regular members, please also contribute to this point by reporting posts.) If another mod agrees with the hiding, they comment as such and close the report. If the other mod disagrees, we have a more in depth discussion about it and go form there. If a majority favour unhiding the post then reinstate the post. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chubbs Posted September 10, 2021 Report Share Posted September 10, 2021 On 9/8/2021 at 6:50 AM, Thebigguy68 said: I’m trying to understand what constitutes crossing the line? You can call players anything you want but when a club official makes a major mistake that cost the club money and Cup progress ... then calling her a useless female dog gets you a warning. -4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lroy Posted September 10, 2021 Report Share Posted September 10, 2021 2 hours ago, chubbs said: You can call players anything you want but when a club official makes a major mistake that cost the club money and Cup progress ... then calling her a useless female dog gets you a warning. Use of sexist language gets you a warning point, correct. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beaker71 Posted September 10, 2021 Report Share Posted September 10, 2021 21 minutes ago, Lroy said: Use of sexist language gets you a warning point, correct. As would or should racist, homophobic, or overtly discriminatory language 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lroy Posted September 10, 2021 Report Share Posted September 10, 2021 10 minutes ago, Beaker71 said: As would or should racist, homophobic, or overtly discriminatory language I agree. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
virtuocity Posted September 10, 2021 Report Share Posted September 10, 2021 On 9/8/2021 at 10:23 PM, Lroy said: As I promised earlier, here's the notes we use for the warning point system And we've just agreed this process for hiding posts: If you see a post you think needs hidden, hide it and report it. (Regular members, please also contribute to this point by reporting posts.) If another mod agrees with the hiding, they comment as such and close the report. If the other mod disagrees, we have a more in depth discussion about it and go form there. If a majority favour unhiding the post then reinstate the post. Ever wonder why you bother? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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