Wrangodog Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 21 minutes ago, gdevoy said: Trump has blood on his hands. He must not be allowed to divert attention to mistakes and misjudgements of others. This whole sorry mess can be parked right at his door. He has made a career out of blaming others. It has to stop. Mistakes and misjudgements are when you ding the car, not when you blow a passenger aircraft out of the sky. The yanks have done it, the Russians have done it, their is no excuse for it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted January 11, 2020 Report Share Posted January 11, 2020 18 minutes ago, Wrangodog said: Mistakes and misjudgements are when you ding the car, not when you blow a passenger aircraft out of the sky. The yanks have done it, the Russians have done it, their is no excuse for it. I agree, but the yanks gave someone a medal for doing it.Hypocracy is nowhere near it when you hear them criticise Iran. They deliberately and unjustifiabky created the atmosphere because of their massively over inflated egos. Then they start lecturing people about how to behave. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangodog Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 (edited) 13 hours ago, gdevoy said: I agree, but the yanks gave someone a medal for doing it.Hypocracy is nowhere near it when you hear them criticise Iran. They deliberately and unjustifiabky created the atmosphere because of their massively over inflated egos. Then they start lecturing people about how to behave. I agree Trump's actions destabilised the region further, if it was possible. It doesn't say much for Iran's missile defence if they can't tell the difference between a passenger aircraft taking off and a cruise missile approaching, and in the process kill some of their own countrymen and women. Even the Flight Radar app would have shown them what it was. Edited January 12, 2020 by Wrangodog 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 3 hours ago, Wrangodog said: I agree Trump's actions destabilised the region further, if it was possible. It doesn't say much for Iran's missile defence if they can't tell the difference between a passenger aircraft taking off and a cruise missile approaching, and in the process kill some of their own countrymen and women. Even the Flight Radar app would have shown them what it was. As I said I have some experience with these systems and I would not have got on any plane going near Iran under these circumstances. Even if ut had been a NATO system being operated buy UK forces who are a lot less trigger happy than the Yanks. These systems are designed to protect ground assets. A false positive here or there is much preferred to missing a threat. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chubbs Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 The plane was not accidentally shot down ... it was a deliberate act. Someone took the information they were given, evaluated it and decided to press the button. The only 'accident' was inability to differentiate between a climbing aircraft and a cruise missile ... and that is more incompetence than anything. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 33 minutes ago, chubbs said: The only 'accident' was inability to differentiate between a climbing aircraft and a cruise missile ... and that is more incompetence than anything. If I showed you the nav. data and radar returns from a cruise missile and the same data from an aircraft climbing away form an airfield I am all but certain you would not be able to say which was which. And even trained military personnel would be less than certain. So there you are with your finger on the button. You know there is something there, you can see it on your monitor. Do you a) Let it go and if it is a US cruise missile and blows up a military installation you will be shot. b) Push the button and if you take out an airliner you may still get a medal. You decide. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangodog Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, gdevoy said: If I showed you the nav. data and radar returns from a cruise missile and the same data from an aircraft climbing away form an airfield I am all but certain you would not be able to say which was which. And even trained military personnel would be less than certain. So there you are with your finger on the button. You know there is something there, you can see it on your monitor. Do you a) Let it go and if it is a US cruise missile and blows up a military installation you will be shot. b) Push the button and if you take out an airliner you may still get a medal. You decide. Despite the fact that Flight Radar would have shown a passenger plane taking off at that exact moment. A wee double check too difficult, ach it was only a bunch of passengers after all. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chubbs Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 19 minutes ago, gdevoy said: If I showed you the nav. data and radar returns from a cruise missile and the same data from an aircraft climbing away form an airfield I am all but certain you would not be able to say which was which. And even trained military personnel would be less than certain. So there you are with your finger on the button. You know there is something there, you can see it on your monitor. Do you a) Let it go and if it is a US cruise missile and blows up a military installation you will be shot. b) Push the button and if you take out an airliner you may still get a medal. You decide. So you believe that a fully trained personnel would be less capable of making a decision than me .... REALLY???? You've posted some utter sh1te in the past but fuk me that takes the biscuit!! Still does not change the fact that someone made the conscious decision to fire the shot .... it wasn't 'an accident' ... it was a mistake. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 4 minutes ago, chubbs said: You've posted some utter sh1te in the past but fuk me that takes the biscuit!! No, the other way around, they would be more capable than you …. but still make a mistake one way and you risk getting your knuckles rapped. The other way and you die. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 23 minutes ago, Wrangodog said: Despite the fact that Flight Radar would have shown a passenger plane taking off at that exact moment. A wee double check too difficult, ach it was only a bunch of passengers after all. You are right, in a fully integrated system there would be IFF checks (I, myself personally would not chose to put my life in it's hands if I had the choice). However I suspect in Iran the "Republican Guard" are a law unto themselves and your "ach it was only a bunch of passengers after all" statement may not be 1,000,000 miles away from their attitude. Hence the protests in the country. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killie1961 Posted January 12, 2020 Report Share Posted January 12, 2020 22 hours ago, gdevoy said: Trump has blood on his hands. He must not be allowed to divert attention to mistakes and misjudgements of others. This whole sorry mess can be parked right at his door. He has made a career out of blaming others. It has to stop. Trump the coward four times he avoided the draft in the Vietnam war the 5th time while a student complained of sore feet absolute cretin of a man 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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