gdevoy Posted April 19, 2020 Report Share Posted April 19, 2020 2 hours ago, Bonbon19 said: Quite an interesting synopsis from an eminent epidemiologist , if you look beyond the header . I think what this is telling me is that there us no real consensus. The government say they are following "the science" but there is in fact no science to follow. The government are panicking based on worst case scenarios from a less than proven model. In the US Trump is blustering his way through based on optimism from equally unproven "science". He us playing Russian Roulette with other peoples lives when the truth us nobody really knows how bad this could get, let alone the best strategy to deal with it. It is a time for a responsible steady hand at the geln in uncertain times and we have Boris. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSI Kilmarnock Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) 10 hours ago, Bonbon19 said: Quite an interesting synopsis from an eminent epidemiologist , if you look beyond the header . 9 hours ago, Bonbon19 said: Basically yes as long as you protect the most vulnerable , look at the Swedish model . It’s meeting with a little bit of resistance after initially being accepted but their numbers are very much lower than ours but on a par with neighbouring countries . The advantage they have over them is that they can come out of the lockdown sooner and get their economy going sooner. What it also said was that the govt was basically bullied by the media into changing its policy , which whatever happens with regards to who had the right policy , isn’t reassuring . But they’re not, the death rate per capita in Sweden is more than double that of their neighbours. Edited April 20, 2020 by CSI Kilmarnock 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 Personally, I wouldn't be taking any advice from a Facebook account called UK Keep Britain United. With the proliferation of fake news over the past few years, the source has to have some sort of credibility! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonbon19 Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 hour ago, CSI Kilmarnock said: But they’re not, the death rate per capita in Sweden is more than double that of their neighbours. I hadn’t checked it for a wee while , you’re right in fact it’s significantly higher compared with Norway and Denmark but the theory is that the deaths wrt surrounding countries at the end of this crisis be the same . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psv_killie Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 11 hours ago, RAG said: I think they are suggesting there's no realistic chance of mass antibody tests until over 50% of people have caught it, then you are almost at that 60% herd immunity threshold. A lot of the 'faith' in the antibody test/passporting, is based on having antibodies equaling a future immunity from covid. Which might not be the case, if you can catch it more than once. There isn't a reliable antibody test that exists right now. Maybe shortly there will be but not right now. The only way is to keep testing for COVID and then isolate and trace. All hopes seem to be on a vaccine. Professor Gilbert was talking on the BBC at the weekend about a vaccine and was very informative however she did suggest that catching the virus wouldn't give you lifetime immunity but she wasn't sure on what timescale the antibodies that are generated would last for. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorro Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 hour ago, Bonbon19 said: I hadn’t checked it for a wee while , you’re right in fact it’s significantly higher compared with Norway and Denmark but the theory is that the deaths wrt surrounding countries at the end of this crisis be the same . It seems a very cold way of looking at things. No consideration for things like patient dignity, compassion or time to care. Just get anyone that’s got it into hospital ASAP, treat them on trolleys in corridors in overwhelmed hospitals, stack the bodies high in giant refrigeration units, so we can get back to buying our coffees in Costa as quickly as possible 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) 37 minutes ago, psv_killie said: Professor Gilbert was talking on the BBC at the weekend about a vaccine and was very informative however she did suggest that catching the virus wouldn't give you lifetime immunity but she wasn't sure on what timescale the antibodies that are generated would last for. Was that on the Marr show? The Oxford professor interviewed there, seemed to suggest a future vaccine (which obviously doesn't even exist at present) would only protect for a year or so and would probably provide a stronger antibody than being previously infected. Bad news all round this covid.. Edited April 20, 2020 by RAG Monday morning sentence structure and spelling! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 48 minutes ago, psv_killie said: .......she wasn't sure ...... This seems to sum up all the informed opinion right now. This is understandable given how new Covid-19 is. Anybody who says they are sure, is either not too bright, ill informed or lying. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonbon19 Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 43 minutes ago, Zorro said: It seems a very cold way of looking at things. No consideration for things like patient dignity, compassion or time to care. Just get anyone that’s got it into hospital ASAP, treat them on trolleys in corridors in overwhelmed hospitals, stack the bodies high in giant refrigeration units, so we can get back to buying our coffees in Costa as quickly as possible I agree it’s a colder way of looking at it and I believe it could only happen in a country like Sweden . At the start they must have believed they had the capacity to cope with the numbers, which I now believe they don’t have hence the growing disquiet. I’m surmising this played a part in the UK’s u turn re this strategy . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psv_killie Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 18 minutes ago, RAG said: Was that on the Marr show? The Oxford professor interviewed there, seemed to suggest a future vaccine (which obviously doesn't even exist at present) would only protect for a year or so and would probably provide a stronger antibody than being previously infected. Bad news all round this covid.. Thats the one. Here is a link to the interview - https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p089xqrl From about 8 mins in she is talking about immunity and the difference between immunity from being infected and from a vaccine. Its worth listening to all of it though 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 minute ago, psv_killie said: From about 8 mins in she is talking about immunity and the difference between immunity from being infected and from a vaccine. Its worth listening to all of it though That's the one man. She also explains that although we can develop and trial vaccines in the UK, we don't currently have the capacity to manufacture 65 million doses if it actually works. It's a s**** state of affairs to be in, PSV, and all the fresh air in the world won't make any f***ing difference! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
psv_killie Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, RAG said: That's the one man. She also explains that although we can develop and trial vaccines in the UK, we don't currently have the capacity to manufacture 65 million doses if it actually works. It's a s**** state of affairs to be in, PSV, and all the fresh air in the world won't make any f***ing difference! Yes she was clearly trying to get some of the big pharma manufacturers and/or the government to be lined up behind this if and it's a big if they manage to get the vaccine up and running. It looks like we are going to be dealing with COVID for a long time. Might even be part of our way of life from here on in. A new cold but more dangerous. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Bonbon19 said: I agree it’s a colder way of looking at it and I believe it could only happen in a country like Sweden . At the start they must have believed they had the capacity to cope with the numbers, which I now believe they don’t have hence the growing disquiet. I’m surmising this played a part in the UK’s u turn re this strategy . Me too. Initially they thought ... heard it all before with SARS and MERS, a few coffin dodgers might snuff it but that's life ..... then the actual numbers of infected and dead started to increase exponentially as predicted by modelling and the projections of said model were terrifying so they panicked and did said U turn. The thing to bear in mind here is that because the progress of the disease matches the model to now, while this does give the model some credibility, it does not verify it is absolutely right over all time. So, with reference to the Trump approach, I'll refer you to the much quoted Harry Callaghan ..... "Do ya feel lucky?" Edited April 20, 2020 by gdevoy 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) 25 minutes ago, psv_killie said: It looks like we are going to be dealing with COVID for a long time. Might even be part of our way of life from here on in. A new cold but more dangerous. This is the 1st wave of something new, no-ones caught before. Would be interesting to see how deadly the common cold is in later life, if you've never had the common cold before. Generally, (so I read anyway) the really dangerous mutations of any virus, are much more likely to naturally die out and run their course, as they're too effective at killing their host, who's bodies they hijacked. Worst outcome of this is, it was man made in origin. Only place in Asia with a level 4 bio lab, is a Chinese city beginning in a W - seems a mighty coincidence. Repercussions of that, could be even more scary than the virus itself.. Edited April 20, 2020 by RAG 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted April 20, 2020 Report Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 hour ago, RAG said: Worst outcome of this is, it was man made in origin. As I understand it the genetic profile of Covid-19 make that seem unlikely. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shropshire_killie Posted April 23, 2020 Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 I know Hancock has had the virus but he looked s**tty at conf tonight. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shropshire_killie Posted April 23, 2020 Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 I know Hancock has had the virus but he looked s**tty at conf tonight. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted April 23, 2020 Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 47 minutes ago, Shropshire_killie said: I know Hancock has had the virus but he looked s**tty at conf tonight. I think the strain of being left in charge by BoJo the no show and being totally out of depth is taking its toll. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted April 23, 2020 Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 38 minutes ago, gdevoy said: I think the strain of being left in charge by BoJo the no show and being totally out of depth is taking its toll. Its cos they've missed all the arbitrary targets they themselves set. Testings nothing like numbers promised, we’re about to go well over the ‘good’ outcome of 20k official deaths. They'll know fine well the FT article yesterday, stating only 53% of deaths happened in hospital, so situation is twice as bad as official headline numbers suggest. PPE shortages, 100 medics dead. The extended lockdown will only crash the economy more. Already we’re in biggest recession in over300 years and are well on track for biggest death rates in Europe. Until they get a vacine next year or year after, the economy will continue to get historically worse, or many, many more people will die - both are bad outcomes This Tory gov. will go down in history as one of the worst in UK history. Even the Trademark Brexit project is now a sideshow to far bigger events. They can only have telethons and clapping sessions for so long, before more people start asking questions about their basic competence as a government. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killie1961 Posted April 23, 2020 Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 55 minutes ago, RAG said: Its cos they've missed all the arbitrary targets they themselves set. Testings nothing like numbers promised, we’re about to go well over the ‘good’ outcome of 20k official deaths. They'll know fine well the FT article yesterday, stating only 53% of deaths happened in hospital, so situation is twice as bad as official headline numbers suggest. PPE shortages, 100 medics dead. The extended lockdown will only crash the economy more. Already we’re in biggest recession in over300 years and are well on track for biggest death rates in Europe. Until they get a vacine next year or year after, the economy will continue to get historically worse, or many, many more people will die - both are bad outcomes This Tory gov. will go down in history as one of the worst in UK history. Even the Trademark Brexit project is now a sideshow to far bigger events. They can only have telethons and clapping sessions for so long, before more people start asking questions about their basic competence as a government. Lions run by Tory donkeys 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beaker71 Posted April 23, 2020 Report Share Posted April 23, 2020 33 minutes ago, killie1961 said: Lions run by Tory donkeys Supported by EVERYONE who voted no in 2o24, and continues to vote for any unionist party. During the initial phases of this pandemic the Scot gov were carrying out more than 20% of all testing carries out on the island. Rather than copy this approach the UK govt reverted to the and decided they knew better and removed the devolved governments control over testing, and.... its be a shambles ever since. They got found out telling suppliers to only supply English care homes, and had to cover their areas big style. They ordered PPE from Trukey and managed to bring in 10% of what they needed 4 days late. Meanwhile the Scot give bring in 11million maks, extra ppe of other kinds, and other equipment. No delays just went and got it. Meanwhile we have a cumnock resident trawling the interweb for nonsense to shout Scotland is s**te,Know your place and do as London says. Shameful now and always will be. Anyone still believe the union is a good thing needs to have a bloody good talk with themselves. This crisis has proven beyond a doubt that the ONLY people who give a s**t about Scotland are the people who live here and the current government of our nation. WM is too busy with bulls**t, lining their own pockets and protecting one part of the UK. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooter Posted April 24, 2020 Report Share Posted April 24, 2020 5 hours ago, RAG said: They can only have telethons and clapping sessions for so long, before more people start asking questions about their basic competence as a government. The NHS should be properly supported by government, not by a 99 year old man struggling to haul himself around his garden. Every charity is a failure of the state to fund what is needed! So when does everyone stop clapping like trained seals and start holding these incompetent, out of depth Tory clowns to account? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted April 24, 2020 Report Share Posted April 24, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, Scooter said: The NHS should be properly supported by government, not by a 99 year old man struggling to haul himself around his garden. Every charity is a failure of the state to fund what is needed! So when does everyone stop clapping like trained seals and start holding these incompetent, out of depth Tory clowns to account? Exactly. In Germany, they properly fund and supply their health service, instead of clapping for it! Even the drive through testing centres, if you can actually get a test, clearly aren't being done properly! Let's play a wee game of 'spot the difference'.. UK (This image was taken at 6:30am from the front page of the BBC websites story on drive through testing. The picture now used there, is not the original one they posted.) USA South Korea Australia Edited April 24, 2020 by RAG Had to edit the post, cos the BBC are changing the picture on the front page of their website from one I posted, to a Haz-Mat suit wearing worker, to a soldier with a surgical mask and rubber gloves - all in the space of 30mins.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beaker71 Posted April 24, 2020 Report Share Posted April 24, 2020 36 minutes ago, RAG said: Exactly. In Germany, they properly fund and supply their health service, instead of clapping for it! Even the drive through testing centres, if you can actually get a test, clearly aren't being done properly! Let's play a wee game of 'spot the difference'.. UK (This image was taken at 6:30am from the front page of the BBC websites story on drive through testing. The picture now used there, is not the original one posted.) USA South Korea Australia The bottom photos are ide tidal to the testing areas in Scotland. My wife and I have had much milder cases than most and she for tested in Huntly. Both people who arrived were fully suited and booted, full face visors and masks. WM are in full propaganda mode with their old pal the Beeb. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted April 24, 2020 Report Share Posted April 24, 2020 Just now, Beaker71 said: WM are in full propaganda mode with their old pal the Beeb. Well why else would you alter the picture on the biggest website in the UK 3 times in 30 minutes! It's insane man. Early bird catches the worm and all that. Hope you and your family are well! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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