RAG Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 1 hour ago, Wee_Eck1979 said: Surely a sporting matter has to be dealt with by CAS? To take the matter to court surely is in breach of UEFA and the SPFL rules? Not necessarily. They needed written permission from the SFA to take it to the Court of Session - clear breach of rules there. Hearts seem to be arguing because the SPFL isn't the governing body, they can launch a legal challenge against the SPFL vote. Other leagues like Belgium and France, were decided by their FA or governments making a 'decision', not as the result of a democratic vote of a members organisation, like the SPFL. Democratic votes sometimes have 'unfair' outcomes for minorities. Much more difficult to successfully challenge a members vote, than a governing boards decision - you'd think anyway.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gdevoy Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, skygod said: Unless they have breached some SPFL rules, I don't see how they can be expelled for exercising a legal right. I am fairly certain taking the SPFL to court is explicitly prohibited under bringing the game into disrepute. On the other hand the EU court of human rights probably says you cannot forbid anybody from going to court. Interesting times. Edited June 20, 2020 by gdevoy 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 11 minutes ago, RAG said: Other leagues like Belgium and France, were decided by their FA or governments making a 'decision', not as the result of a democratic vote of a members organisation, like the SPFL. As far as the role of government is concerned, I don’t think that was any different from these countries (Scotland and England) where government authorisation was required. I can’t speak for Belgium but I know that in France the League (LFP) unilaterally declared the season over, which led to unsuccessful legal action by three clubs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 (edited) 28 minutes ago, skygod said: As far as the role of government is concerned, I don’t think that was any different from these countries (Scotland and England) where government authorisation was required. I can’t speak for Belgium but I know that in France the League (LFP) unilaterally declared the season over, which led to unsuccessful legal action by three clubs. The LFP were told by the French gov. to end the season. In the UK and Scotland, that didn't happen. The announcement by the LFP comes after Prime Minister Edouard Philippe said on Tuesday that "professional sports leagues, notably football, cannot restart" because of the pandemic. "There is no ambiguity about this declaration. We needed to make a final decision about this season. We acknowledge that the 2019-20 season is over," said LFP president Nathalie Boy de la Tour, in a conference call with reporters. (AFP, April30) Edited June 20, 2020 by RAG 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjkillie007 Posted June 20, 2020 Report Share Posted June 20, 2020 Even if the court found the vote was against the rules the spfl clubs could then vote to change the rules and relegate hearts etc again. I'm really not sure what hearts and Partick think they are going to achieve. Were probably going for an it of court settlement 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangodog Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 If the Jambos/Thistle are basing part of their appeal on the two French clubs, Amiens and Toulouse not being relegated they're out of luck. The French Football League has upheld the decision to demote the teams. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 2 minutes ago, Wrangodog said: If the Jambos/Thistle are basing part of their appeal on the two French clubs, Amiens and Toulouse not being relegated they're out of luck. The French Football League has upheld the decision to demote the teams. From what I could gather listening to Sportsound, Hearts will hit the SPFL for the £8m in compensation if relegation is upheld, claiming voting shenanigans with Dundee having voted twice. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gazza Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 1 hour ago, RAG said: From what I could gather listening to Sportsound, Hearts will hit the SPFL for the £8m in compensation if relegation is upheld, claiming voting shenanigans with Dundee having voted twice. Quite right too,we would all be demanding the same if it was killie -14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangodog Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 1 hour ago, RAG said: From what I could gather listening to Sportsound, Hearts will hit the SPFL for the £8m in compensation if relegation is upheld, claiming voting shenanigans with Dundee having voted twice. Didn't Jambos vote to end the league though ? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted June 27, 2020 Report Share Posted June 27, 2020 21 minutes ago, Wrangodog said: Didn't Jambos vote to end the league though ? Yes! On Sportsound, they claimed the court case could have been avoided by Doncaster holding another vote, maybe a third or fourth, until it went through - bit like Teresa May and Brexit. The crux of the Jambos argument seems to be Dundee voted twice, or were influenced in some way to change their 'second' vote, so the ballot on ending the league was - in their view - invalid. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
historyman Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 (edited) Given that the top leagues in Switzerland Sweden Russia Portugal Norway Greece Denmark Austria Italy Spain and England haven’t called or cancelled their seasons it’s surprising that the teams in the SPFL decided to do so. The main leagues that have done so seem to be France and Netherlands. Edited June 28, 2020 by historyman 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mackpomm Posted June 28, 2020 Report Share Posted June 28, 2020 On 6/19/2020 at 9:40 AM, kfc_superteam said: I'm actually with Hearts and Thistle on this one. League should have been expanded as games weren't completed. All other clubs were pretty much 'stuff you we are fine', 'go take your medicine', 'you weren't that good this season so would probably go down anyway'. Basically they didn't want to lose out on a percentage of prize money, tv money. Well they are going to lose out on a lot more now. Dundee Utd, Raith and Cove haven't completed a full season so shouldn't be given promotion at the expenses of these other clubs. In fact Dundee Utd were against league reconstruction. Ultimately its about doing the right thing and the other clubs were just being awkward and short sighted. The spfl is unique in that all the clubs decide things and vote. No other league operates like this and is why we are going backwards. I agree. I'm sure the supporters of all other Scottish clubs would resent relegation in similar circumstances to Hearts and Patrick. Says nothing positive about the organisers and owners of Scottish football. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beaker71 Posted June 29, 2020 Report Share Posted June 29, 2020 6 hours ago, mackpomm said: I agree. I'm sure the supporters of all other Scottish clubs would resent relegation in similar circumstances to Hearts and Patrick. Says nothing positive about the organisers and owners of Scottish football. Partick possibly, but Hearts have been honking for 2 years, and deserve to get relegated. Their behaviour as a club in this whole situation has been deplorable, demanding 8 million quid, demanding league reconstruction on a temporary basis to give them breathing space to fix the cluster Budge has created. Do they think they're secxo! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No.1 Jimmy Posted June 29, 2020 Report Share Posted June 29, 2020 I had good deal of sympathy for Hearts & Thistle and felt they probably did deserve some degree of compensation, but then they come away this figure of 10 million....Really??? Hearts have been so combative throughout this process and the way Anne and that arrogant pr&#k Levein will not take any responsibility for the predicament that they find themselves in, has just put my back up against them so as far as I’m concerned they can “take their medicine “ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAG Posted June 29, 2020 Report Share Posted June 29, 2020 14 hours ago, historyman said: Given that the top leagues in Switzerland Sweden Russia Portugal Norway Greece Denmark Austria Italy Spain and England haven’t called or cancelled their seasons it’s surprising that the teams in the SPFL decided to do so. The main leagues that have done so seem to be France and Netherlands. All the countries that called their leagues also have the worst covid cases. If it wasn't for the English leagues massive amount of cash - even the Championship in England is, I think, the 5th or 6th biggest TV deal in Europe - the top 2 English leagues would have been called too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trenwick Posted June 29, 2020 Report Share Posted June 29, 2020 I really think that is funny that a team with a budget of prob arguably the highest of all non-old firm clubs and have been rubbish all season and are sitting bottom of the league on merit want more for being relegated than Celtic get for winning the league, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trojan76 Posted June 29, 2020 Report Share Posted June 29, 2020 on a footballing point, I't doesn't massively bother me about Hearts going down, though i do like and away day to Tynecastle. I do think that league reconstruction should have been given more consideration rather than just clubs thinking about their own pockets, would 14-10-10-10 really have been that bad? Hearts deserved to go down and the league called, they should have did the same down south too, when you're still getting 100-200 people dying each day of COVID you need to think of why they are still playing out the league. Money talks, but this is just ugly and shows the worst aspect to what has happened to football now, it all boils down to cash. As for Heart's claim with Thistle, god know's where the figure of £10m came from, are we expected to believe relegation is costing Hearts £8m and Thistle £2m? Surely that's can't be right? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prahakillie Posted June 29, 2020 Report Share Posted June 29, 2020 8 minutes ago, Trojan76 said: I do think that league reconstruction should have been given more consideration rather than just clubs thinking about their own pockets, would 14-10-10-10 really have been that bad? The clubs proposing and supporting the change were just thinking about their own pockets though. If it is for the good of the game give it more consideration and come up with a longer term solution rather than a quick fix. And a solution which will be implemented from the end of the next season, not immediately. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clunk Posted July 2, 2020 Report Share Posted July 2, 2020 Nearly 2 days know still no decision how long does it take 2 days at court what's going on 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
piffer Posted July 2, 2020 Report Share Posted July 2, 2020 On 6/29/2020 at 4:45 PM, Trojan76 said: I do think that league reconstruction should have been given more consideration rather than just clubs thinking about their own pockets, would 14-10-10-10 really have been that bad? If they really want league reconstruction let the league go as is for next season and start a balanced working group to think about reconstruction. Hearts and others had absolutely no interest in changing the setup until decisions put their status at risk. If we are going to change the entire structure of the game a half arsed effort worked out in no more than a week by teams only really interested in self preservation is not the answer. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bigbill Posted July 2, 2020 Report Share Posted July 2, 2020 3 hours ago, piffer said: If they really want league reconstruction let the league go as is for next season and start a balanced working group to think about reconstruction. Hearts and others had absolutely no interest in changing the setup until decisions put their status at risk. If we are going to change the entire structure of the game a half arsed effort worked out in no more than a week by teams only really interested in self preservation is not the answer. I've been thinking this too. Have a focus group working on it through this upcoming season with the prospect of introducing it at the beginning of season 22/23, that way all clubs know what they will be playing for in season 21/22. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wrangodog Posted July 2, 2020 Report Share Posted July 2, 2020 20 minutes ago, Bigbill said: I've been thinking this too. Have a focus group working on it through this upcoming season with the prospect of introducing it at the beginning of season 22/23, that way all clubs know what they will be playing for in season 21/22. Just ask Celtic and Sevco, because either of them can vote it down. They're not going to vote for anything radically different because of the way the voting system is set up. C&S want four games per season, Sky want them to have four games per season, so anything different has to be built around that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gjkillie007 Posted July 3, 2020 Report Share Posted July 3, 2020 On 6/28/2020 at 8:57 PM, historyman said: Given that the top leagues in Switzerland Sweden Russia Portugal Norway Greece Denmark Austria Italy Spain and England haven’t called or cancelled their seasons it’s surprising that the teams in the SPFL decided to do so. The main leagues that have done so seem to be France and Netherlands. Without paying spectators there is no way the SPFL (top flight included) could have played on. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kilMARKnock Posted July 3, 2020 Report Share Posted July 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, gjkillie007 said: Without paying spectators there is no way the SPFL (top flight included) could have played on. I like the idea of being paid to attend, ever thought of a career in politics you could be on to a winner 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
historyman Posted July 3, 2020 Report Share Posted July 3, 2020 32 minutes ago, gjkillie007 said: Without paying spectators there is no way the SPFL (top flight included) could have played on. You miss the point. That’s exactly what’s going to happen from 1st August. So if it can be done for the new league season then why not to finish off the old one? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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