jasper Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 With increasing senility and lockdown boredom, I'm finding it hard to distinguish between reality and illusion. Recently, I was so convinced that I had seen Ivor Allchurch play at RP that I even posted about it. Now, what I want to know is whether Brian McIlroy got a hat-trick of headers at East End Park some time in the sixties or did I just create it out of half-remembered Scotsport snowstorms and Montfordian stramashes. Everygame doesn't help. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 12, 2020 Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 On 4 January 1964 he scored a hat-trick at EEP in a 3-2 win, to keep us two points clear of Rangers at the top of the table. It was one of six for the club including four in the 9-2 win over Falkirk. Were they all headers? Can't say, but you remembered that much so I'm inclined to think they were! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasper Posted May 12, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 12, 2020 4 minutes ago, skygod said: On 4 January 1964 he scored a hat-trick at EEP in a 3-2 win, to keep us two points clear of Rangers at the top of the table. It was one of six for the club including four in the 9-2 win over Falkirk. Were they all headers? Can't say, but you remembered that much so I'm inclined to think they were! Thank God for that, I'm not cracking up as much as I had feared. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbm1965 Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 From my reading of a match report on that game only the first two were headers. When I have time I'll see if I can extract the cutting safely from the old scrapbook and copy it. It seems to have bee a cracker of a game. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Superscot Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 And what a fantastic but underrated player Brien McIlroy was. His goal tally for a winger was exceptional. Why was he never capped, even at League level? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 (edited) As I said, McIlroy scored six hat-tricks, including a four. The record for most hat-tricks for the club is held by Willie Culley with ten. He also had one four. Next is Andy Kerr with eight, including one five and two fours. Also James "Bud" Maxwell. McIlroy is joined on six by James "Bummer" Campbell, who scored a remarkable eight in a 13-2 Scottish Cup win over Saltcoats Vics. James Weir scored six, also in a Scottish Cup tie against Paisley Academicals (11-1). Five goals in a match were scored by Kris Boyd against Dundee Utd, Willie Watters v. QoS, Kerr against Airdrie, John Aitken v. Dundee Utd, Robert McGowan v. Morton and David Maitland against Orion in the Scottish Cup. Kenny Cameron scored eight goals, including two hat-tricks, in his first four games for the club. 51 minutes ago, Jimmy Superscot said: And what a fantastic but underrated player Brien McIlroy was. His goal tally for a winger was exceptional. Why was he never capped, even at League level? The closest he came to being capped was in one of those Scottish League v. Scotland matches which served as a trial for the annual match versus England (that's how big a deal it used to be). Edited May 13, 2020 by skygod 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Superscot Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 1 minute ago, skygod said: The closest he came to being capped was in one of those Scottish League v. Scotland matches which served as a trial for the annual match England (that's how big a deal it used to be). Didn’t know that, but sadly didn’t lead onto any official caps. Presumably there were OF wingers regularly picked ahead of him... with a fraction of his ability. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 (edited) He was probably in competition with Davie Wilson, who was a prolific goalscorer too for a winger. John Hughes as well, although he was more of a centre forward playing on the wing. Then Willie Johnston and Bobby Lennox. It was a bit of an OF closed shop - Willie Henderson sometimes played on the left to accommodate Alex Scott or Jinky Johnstone. I think Scotland teams were still selected by an SFA committee at the time. Edited May 13, 2020 by skygod 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fankle Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 15 minutes ago, Jimmy Superscot said: And what a fantastic but underrated player Brien McIlroy was. Was his name Brien or Brian? Have seen it spelled both ways. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 Looking at that Scotland v. Scottish League match at Ibrox in February 1964, McIlroy actually played in the Scotland team along with Campbell Forsyth. Beattie, King and McGrory were in the League team. McIlroy scored in a 3-1 win. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 4 minutes ago, Fankle said: Was his name Brien or Brian? Have seen it spelled both ways. It was Brien. I think it was a traditional family name. It only came widely to light fairly recently. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Superscot Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 (edited) 23 minutes ago, skygod said: He was probably in competition with Davie Wilson, who was a prolific goalscorer too for a winger. John Hughes as well, although he was more of a centre forward playing on the wing. Yes, they both played during his prolific years, especially Wilson. Willie Henderson and Jimmy Robertson also played but were normally right wingers. The one player who caused a raised eyebrow was George Mulhall a left winger with Aberdeen and Sunderland who won 3 caps - 1 with Dons in 1959 which was before Brien’s time, but 2 with Sunderland in 1962/63, when some, especially those wearing blue and white tinted specs, might have expected Brien to get the nod. Edited May 13, 2020 by Jimmy Superscot Wrong year 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fankle Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 20 minutes ago, skygod said: He was probably in competition with Davie Wilson, who was a prolific goalscorer too for a winger. John Hughes as well, although he was more of a centre forward playing on the wing. Then Willie Johnston and Bobby Lennox. It was a bit of an OF closed shop - Willie Henderson sometimes played on the left to accommodate Alex Scott or Jinky Johnstone. I think Scotland teams were still selected by an SFA committee at the time. Looking back at the records in 1965 a teenage Willie Johnston was drafted into the Scotland team after just a handful of games for Rangers, Lennox took that jersey for most of the rest of the 60s though. The SFA selection committee wasn't used after the late 50s. There was a bit of a merry go round of scotland managers in the mid 60s, including Ian McColl, Jock Stein and Malky MacDonald (who you'd think would be sympathetic to capping Killie players!) 11 minutes ago, skygod said: It was Brien. I think it was a traditional family name. It only came widely to light fairly recently. Cheers, that explains the confusion. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 2 minutes ago, Fankle said: ....Malky MacDonald (who you'd think would be sympathetic to capping Killie players!) He was caretaker for just two matches (and selected Bobby Ferguson!). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy Superscot Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 8 minutes ago, Fankle said: Looking back at the records in 1965 a teenage Willie Johnston was drafted into the Scotland team after just a handful of games for Rangers, Lennox took that jersey for most of the rest of the 60s though. The SFA selection committee wasn't used after the late 50s. There was a bit of a merry go round of scotland managers in the mid 60s, including Ian McColl, Jock Stein and Malky MacDonald (who you'd think would be sympathetic to capping Killie players!) Cheers, that explains the confusion. Yes, I missed Willie Johnston - he also played in 1966, notably in the 3-4 defeat to England at Hampton with Jimmy Johnstone on the other wing. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Fankle said: The SFA selection committee wasn't used after the late 50s. I know Scotland had a full-time manager in the early 1960s but teams were still selected by a committee. Bobby Brown in 1967 was the first to have full control. It was a continual source of debate at the time with the likes of, I think, Willie Cunningham and Tommy Docherty turning the job down because of the lack of control. Edited May 13, 2020 by skygod 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasper Posted May 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 2 hours ago, Fankle said: Was his name Brien or Brian? Have seen it spelled both ways. The story goes that when McIlroy first signed for Rangers as a very young man, Scot Symon called him over in training one day and said,"What's your name, son ?" "Jimmy, Mister Symon." "We've got too many Jimmies here. What's your middle name ?" "Brian." "Right, from now on, you're Brian." And so it was. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 His first name was indeed James! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pompey Repatriated Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 How many hatricks did Boyd score 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 Just two - against Dumbarton in a League Cup tie, and the five against Dundee Utd. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Deserter Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 Link to the match report in the Glasgow Herald archive. We came back from 2 nil down: https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=GGgVawPscysC&dat=19640106&printsec=frontpage&hl=en 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 (edited) A win at East End Park was always especially sweet in the 1960s! They were a good team and could have won the double in 1964-65 - one point behind Killie and Hearts (with a superior goal average to both) and lost in the cup final. Guys like Roy Barry (who was still at Hearts at that time), Willie and Tommy Callaghan, Alex Edwards, Bert Paton, Jackie Sinclair and SAF were excellent. Edited May 13, 2020 by skygod 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasper Posted May 13, 2020 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 (edited) George Peebles of Dunfermline was also massively influential. A goal-scoring winger, he used to give me the fear. There was also a huge, bald guy who played centre-forward, though this might have been later. He simply used to throw defenders out of the way. ( It was Charlie Dickson, who left them in 1964. Very high-scoring fans favourite. Long live Google.) 8 minutes ago, skygod said: A win at East End Park was always especially sweet in the 1960s! They were a good team and could have won the double in 1964-65 - one point behind Killie and Hearts (with a superior goal average to both) and lost in the cup final. Guys like Roy Barry - who was still at Hearts at that time, Willie and Tom Callaghan, Alex Edwards, Bert Paton, Jackie Sinclair and SAF were excellent. Edited May 13, 2020 by jasper afterthoughts 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skygod Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 (edited) Charlie Dickson. Another one there - Harry Melrose. Edited May 13, 2020 by skygod 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jbm1965 Posted May 13, 2020 Report Share Posted May 13, 2020 2 hours ago, skygod said: A win at East End Park was always especially sweet in the 1960s! They were a good team and could have won the double in 1964-65 - one point behind Killie and Hearts (with a superior goal average to both) and lost in the cup final. Guys like Roy Barry (who was still at Hearts at that time), Willie and Tommy Callaghan, Alex Edwards, Bert Paton, Jackie Sinclair and SAF were excellent. Aye we had a right rivalry with the Pars in the 60s. We seemed to play them quite often in the cups and though we'd usually get the better of them in the league cup we always seemed to fall short in the Scottish Cup. Mind that in one cup tie Tiny had a big part in a defeat at East End Park. It was 1-1 with Killie having scored with a classic mazy from McInally when Bert Paton linked his arm with Frank Beattie's pulling Frank out of his way as he lashed out at cross. The ball arrowed into the net for a spectacular goal and to the astonishment of the large Killie support our "friend" Tiny saw nothing wrong and awarded the goal. Sadly some of our support chose to take their revenge on the British Rail football special on the way home. My memories of the time always seem to be of games at East End Park, a cracking goal from Davie Sneddon in a 3-1 win in a sectional match in the League Cup and Matt Watson's jousts with Alex Edwards, they played as if they hated each other, which boiled over in one match when they ended up rolling about on the turf trying to knock lumps out of each other. Needless to say the ref was unimpressed and invited them to take their leave of the action. An incident I've never seen anything like in the many years and games since. For the benefit of our younger fans Tiny was a small lump of lard who was given the title of referee and who seemed to spell disaster whenever Killie had the misfortune to cross his path. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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