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Alex Dyer Megathread™

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Nigel Clough has left Burton Albion.

On the face of it, he's out of league salary-wise but he's used to managing as far down as non-league and has sacrificed himself (and his scout brother and assistant Gary Crosbie) to save the club, so he has principles. 

He must be well familiar with the way to Killie, having watched Bryson and Sammon as often!

 

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Not like Killie fans to slaughter someone before they've had a fair crack of the whip eh? The way the season ended didn't give Dyer a chance to pull things together and he was trying to rescue the season with a squad that had all but fallen to pieces. Maybe with some time and some of his own signings (and some support, he's the Killie manager, some support wouldn't go amiss) we will see a far better team and some more consistency. He proved that he was capable of results and was let down a few times by individual errors, and we were all already in a huff with the club before he was given a chance at all. This season coming is going to be unprecedented as well and many clubs will struggle on all sorts of levels, is it the time to bring in another unknown quantity or should we try and find some stability because we might well have to reply on some of the youth prospects the way things are going, we're quibbling about signings and we will be lucky to come out the other side of this with a club. The financial effect of this virus is being underplayed by many so that there is no panic, but we do not have the cash reserves to be splashing out a complete overhaul. I'll be honest and admit I wouldn't say no to Gary Holt if there were no financial penalties, he knows the club, knows the fans, has experience at various levels and sometimes the right man in the right job can make all the difference; but what happened last season is not going to be repeated and we'll probably just have to accept that and get behind the club and everyone there that remains.

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29 minutes ago, rb_506 said:

....what happened last season is not going to be repeated.....

I don't see why not, in normal circumstances at least. Motherwell have just "finished" third. 

But these are exceptional times and I get the idea that the devil you know is preferable. But AD's results were far from great and, extended over a longer period, would have seen us in real trouble. 

I think his indifference towards the job puzzles people and, when added to the poor results, doesn't excite. 

The club needs stability but I'm not convinced that AD represents safe hands. But we don't know how things are going to pan out and I suppose we won't be alone in going forward conservatively.    

 

 

Edited by skygod

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Some of the problem we have with management at the moment is the hard work which is undone.

Clarke had Rugby park FULL of killie fans for an old firm game. It doesnt matter how important the game was, it was still full.

Unfortunately between the board, alessio, Dyer and Fowler. This season has been a total shambles and a lot of returned fans have gone again. To be honest I'm quite happy its over for the moment. (Just not in the circumstances it happened(covid19))

We need a manager that can reunite us, again. 

Clough is an unbelievable shout if he fancies a challenge on the cheap compared to what he will of had previously

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I must admit I am still in the dark as to why Alessio was sacked, other than the anecdotal evidence that some (senior) players didn’t like him. It would be good to get something from the club, but that ship has sailed and no doubt based on non-disclosure agreements with Alessio himself.

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@rb_506 when you see what we actually have left in the squad the only option we have is an overhaul. 11 players they class as first team squad but not many you’d class as regulars. Lyle hasn’t played and Cameron can barely be in double figures if he is.
In terms of going with another unknown quantity that’s a matter of opinion. For me Dyer has not done enough in the games he had to get the job. Would that have changed in the remaining fixtures who knows. 

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15 minutes ago, killie billies pal said:

Clough comes across as a bit dour, not sure the Killie players would like him 

Maybe what we need. Main reason Alessio is gone. "Players didnt like him". Clough wouldn't stand for it the way Alessio did though. I wouldn't have thought anyway

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43 minutes ago, Secret Squirrel said:

Not had a fair crack at the whip you must be joking the man has had 15 games and a transfer window to find his feet. You would think Angelo had us in the relegation places the way people go on about the so called 'crisis'. When Angelo left we had the third best defensive record in the league which Dyer has seen too quite well letting us slip to sixth. Also Gary Holt that you just mentioned went on a nine game windless run, Angelo was on a four game run when he was sacked, so I ask why is Holt's acceptable but Angelo's is a crisis?

Maybe when the Dyer supporters can offer more than vague murmurings of improvements and fuzzy what ifs I will take the idea of him as permanent manager seriously.    

Probably shouldn't bite but I will... 

There's so much to take into account over the course of the season. The running of the club was so bad this season that I don't think either manager actually got a fair crack of the whip.

We had no transfer policy whatsoever throughout the summer and botched January. That left us with a squad that I'd actually argue was incompetent for participation in the top league. We didn't have enough strikers or wingers at any point we didn't have enough creative players at any point. We didn't have enough players full stop so we couldn't change games. We could barely change tactics. 

Alessio gave us stability but whatever was going on behind the scenes clearly meant it was toxic and never going to work.

His record has to be taken alongside the fact that the league was utter s**t until December/January when teams woke up a bit. St Johnstone were atrocious, Hearts were atrocious, Hibs were imploding, Aberdeen were stuttering all over the place - only Motherwell could hold it together. We were dire to watch but ran on the fumes of Clarke and the core quality of those players for a while. Our downturn coincides directly with clubs around us getting better players and managers and getting back to where you would expect them to be performance wise. 

Dyer had to pick up the pieces with two of the worst goalkeepers I've ever seen and a stretched squad who were pissed off and low on confidence. Not easy. 

None of that to say give him a break - I was disappointed. Conspiring to lose at Accies were dreadful and I think we were spiralling downward a bit. He didn't fill me with confidence and the ability to change games was a big problem. 

But it's all so tangled up in the dumpster fire of everything that came before. 

And its wrong to say there's nothing to be positive about. When Motherwell, clearly third best team in the league, came to Rugby Park at their peak we were every bit as good as them and only lost because of Branescu. The Rangers win was brilliant. I think we looked as good as golden boy Jack Ross's Hibs when we lost narrowly to them as well. There's plenty in that which makes me think a proper squad under Dyer could do fine. 

A long way of saying that we were nothing like as good as some say under Alessio and nothing like as bad as some say under Dyer. 

No pandemic, I would have rolled the dice and tried for another manager. With all that's going on I think Dyer is the right call. I'd be very surprised if we were in relegation danger under him if we can keep hold of Brophy, Kabamba, Power, Dicker and build a squad around they core. 

It might be that next season - whatever that looks like - is his proper audition to see whether he's the man long term. 

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I don't think Dyer will be anywhere near as bad as some are making out here. There was a marked improvement in performance even if results remained inconsistent. He addressed the issues with playing one up front which were evident for a full year and ignored by previous managers... bit his lack of substitutions at times lets him down.

At this stage with the entire footballing world up in the air, I'm willing to give him a chance and a proper pre season.

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34 minutes ago, Bullitt said:

I don't think Dyer will be anywhere near as bad as some are making out here. There was a marked improvement in performance even if results remained inconsistent. He addressed the issues with playing one up front which were evident for a full year and ignored by previous managers... bit his lack of substitutions at times lets him down.

At this stage with the entire footballing world up in the air, I'm willing to give him a chance and a proper pre season.

That's how I feel. Seems to be a lot of focus on the negatives and complete ignorance to what he brought to the plate. In a short period of time he made the changes we were crying out for at the time. Got us able to attack again, got Brophy firing. Tactically he wasn't clueless, if you look at Aberdeen away in the cup, the way he approached Rangers in the win - he made clever system changes when needed it was just he made a blunder in the second leg which had worked previously. He left Kiltie out when he was looking good and we ended up on the end of a defeat just before lockdown. There were as many positives as there were negatives for me.

I wasn't on board with the Alessio firing, didn't feel he deserved it but you can't take that out on Dyer. On the inside it obviously wasn't going to get better. I feel Dyer's inexperience and misjudgements at times would be given a massive amount more slack if he'd taken over directly from Clarke. The whole Alessio experiment regardless of where you stand on the matter seems to have left a bitter taste in everyone's mouth and there are a large group at the club that seemingly are going to have to pay for it forever.

 

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As decision seems to been made by the board , though not confirmed publicly , we will just have to hope AD can prove himself and have a team ready for whenever football resumes ....

Lot will depend on the recruitment process this summer and if AD and Fowler can both identify the right players and get deals done ahead of rival clubs given the cirumstances , 

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Recruitment is what bothers me. What is AD's vision? How would he sell the club? stuff like that. He comes across as a lovely guy, but humble and almost introverted. If he is not the guy to sell Killie to players, is it Fow? Again a down to earth, modest sounding guy. 

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1 hour ago, KenVaagen1984 said:

Recruitment is what bothers me. What is AD's vision? How would he sell the club? stuff like that. He comes across as a lovely guy, but humble and almost introverted. If he is not the guy to sell Killie to players, is it Fow? Again a down to earth, modest sounding guy. 

I'd much rather buy from a down to earth, modest guy than a brash, over-confident charlatan like Lee Clarke or Jimmy Calderwood!

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Why even bother debating this? Billy Bowie has already said that Dyer will be the manager if he wants to be. In the current climate I can't see Dyer wanting to go elsewhere so he will be the manager for the start of the next season - whenever that may be.

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My worry is that Dyer will go with the bare minimum squad, trusting those he knows, like Kirk and Macdonald. 

And this will please Bowie as it won't break the bank

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18 minutes ago, gjkillie007 said:

Why even bother debating this? Billy Bowie has already said that Dyer will be the manager if he wants to be. In the current climate I can't see Dyer wanting to go elsewhere so he will be the manager for the start of the next season - whenever that may be.

Has Dyer actually said he wants it? The fact he didn’t say that when AA left annoyed a lot of supporters. He then came out after the St Mirren game and turned it n the club saying they had to do something but wouldn’t say he actually wanted the job again.

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48 minutes ago, Mister Y said:

I'd much rather buy from a down to earth, modest guy than a brash, over-confident charlatan like Lee Clarke or Jimmy Calderwood!

Its footballers we're talking about here but...

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If we start next season if after in charge I wouldn’t be at all surprised if he was gone after a dozen games. 

If Tommy Wright is fed up commuting from Northern Ireland to Perth we should see if he’d be happy to stop off at Kilmarnock. A level of experience and success that is night and day when compared to Dyer. 

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2 hours ago, Mister Y said:

I'd much rather buy from a down to earth, modest guy than a brash, over-confident charlatan like Lee Clarke or Jimmy Calderwood!

We were 6th in the league when Clark left.

I’ve seen nothing from Dyer to suggest he’ll have us competing for a top half position next suggestion

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14 hours ago, mitch14 said:

We had no transfer policy whatsoever throughout the summer and botched January. That left us with a squad that I'd actually argue was incompetent for participation in the top league. We didn't have enough strikers or wingers at any point we didn't have enough creative players at any point. We didn't have enough players full stop so we couldn't change games. We could barely change tactics. 

And who was responsible for the botched window in January? Everything you state is true and obvious but wasn’t addressed. Harry Bunn? What a joke. 
And as for tactics, anyone who was at the St Mirren game at Christmas would have seen a guy who was completely lost. 
I’ve no doubt Dyer is a nice guy and most of the players like him but he is 54 years old and before the Killie job landed in his lap his managerial experience consisted of about two years at two minor league clubs I haven't even heard of. If he had been assistant at any club other than Killie and had submitted his CV for the job it would have been rejected out of hand. 
It’s a big difference from coach to manager and I fear that we will struggle next season with Dyer in charge. 

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2 hours ago, gjkillie007 said:

Why even bother debating this? Billy Bowie has already said that Dyer will be the manager if he wants to be. In the current climate I can't see Dyer wanting to go elsewhere so he will be the manager for the start of the next season - whenever that may be.

Probably because Dyer has yet to say he wants the job. Since he has been in place since last November that doesn’t say much for his level of enthusiasm. 

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20 minutes ago, historyman said:

And who was responsible for the botched window in January? Everything you state is true and obvious but wasn’t addressed. Harry Bunn? What a joke. 
And as for tactics, anyone who was at the St Mirren game at Christmas would have seen a guy who was completely lost. 
I’ve no doubt Dyer is a nice guy and most of the players like him but he is 54 years old and before the Killie job landed in his lap his managerial experience consisted of about two years at two minor league clubs I haven't even heard of. If he had been assistant at any club other than Killie and had submitted his CV for the job it would have been rejected out of hand. 
It’s a big difference from coach to manager and I fear that we will struggle next season with Dyer in charge. 

St Mirren was one of the worst Killie performances I've ever seen. But it's very selective to focus on that, particularly as it was before we got players in, particularly Kabamba, and without SoD, Power and Findlay. 

Is February not a better judge? Beat Rangers, credibile draw at Pittodrie, tore Hearts to shreds (it was only tihjt because of Branescu losing the head) and beating County three one at home.

January is a fair point, but in still unclear on whose fault it was and lean towards Fowler and the fact that the setup still wasn't up to scratch.

Kabamba was a brilliant signing. Going by the interviews afterwards, Dyer would have been of the impression on the afternoon of the window closing that Tshbola was done and dusted, Roland Aaron's was looking likely and a few other targets he'd agreed with Fowler were likely too. 

Depending on what the story is with the players that he turned down (I still get the impression that was essentially saying I'd rather play Connell than a risky Ndjoli type) it's difficult to know how much to criticise Dyer. 

I think there was enough to show he was a competent boss (ie in the way any number of managers could come in and be), but it's just a question of whether he's anything more than that. 

Edited by mitch14

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16 hours ago, killie billies pal said:

Clough comes across as a bit dour, not sure the Killie players would like him 

 So was his father, a man who made dour look cuddly, but he was one of the greatest of all time, as was the relentlessly grim Willie Waddell.

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